Divisional Round: Packers @ 49ers - Saturday, Jan 20th 7:15pm (Fox)

[Joseph Zarr]

I absolutely know the Packers were playing with proverbial house money and I am extremely grateful as a fan they got the experience and absolutely showed they belong in the conversation of elite NFC teams.

AND, it's a day later and I am still pretty dang salty in the end they simply ended up filing into the lineage of epic choke jobs by Packer teams in the playoffs. It's painful. No other way to get around it. Sigh.

[yourout]

36 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

Purdy is a very good game manager type. Nothing I saw last night changed my mind. He was Green Bay Santa Claus and we returned all the presents. 

He sucked worse than Love did. 

 

He was pretty bad.

If you were ever going to beat them they were right for the picking last night.

[adambr2]

Did anyone ever hear any explanation as to why there was no intentional grounding called on the play or two before the Kittle TD?

Purdy was clearly in the pocket, and there was absolutely NO 49er anywhere close.

[young guns]

33 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

Did anyone ever hear any explanation as to why there was no intentional grounding called on the play or two before the Kittle TD?

Purdy was clearly in the pocket, and there was absolutely NO 49er anywhere close.

I was about to post about that but then I heard in the background of the broadcast the ref announcing he was out of the pocket, but they never mentioned it or showed a replay of where the qb was on the broadcast.

[Joseph Zarr]

2 hours ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

Purdy is a very good game manager type. Nothing I saw last night changed my mind. He was Green Bay Santa Claus and we returned all the presents. 

He sucked worse than Love did. 

 

Heading into the 4th qtr, Love was the same Love we saw for the past 9 weeks: dominant. It looked like when he lost Tom to injury that all changed. He rushed things and it looked like he didn't trust the pocket. That 4th qtr, tho, man that was a flashback to his early-to-mid season struggles. Such a rough way to go out with that ill-advised Favre-esque throw. That one really hurt.

[Joseph Zarr]

Just now, young guns said:

I was about to post about that but then I heard in the background of the broadcast the ref announcing he was out of the pocket, but they never mentioned it or showed a replay of where the qb was on the broadcast.

He was absolutely IN the pocket:

As you see here he absolutely releases the throw within the original set of the LT. Botched no call.

[young guns]

Well that sucks.  Obviously at the time I didn't know, and when I heard the announcement plus the fact the broadcast never even thought to bring it up meant he probably was out, but yeah he was still in by a decent amount.

 

That call, the one spot they challenged and won, the 4th down spot, a face mask being missed, possibly more going against us and I can't think of one thing(and I'm pretty good about admitting when things were wrong in our favor) that I can say the refs gave us just sucks.

[yourout]

10 minutes ago, young guns said:

Well that sucks.  Obviously at the time I didn't know, and when I heard the announcement plus the fact the broadcast never even thought to bring it up meant he probably was out, but yeah he was still in by a decent amount.

 

That call, the one spot they challenged and won, the 4th down spot, a face mask being missed, possibly more going against us and I can't think of one thing(and I'm pretty good about admitting when things were wrong in our favor) that I can say the refs gave us just sucks.

The one side judge consistently shorted the Packers spots by a yard.

[igor67]

I thought I saw some very ungenerous 49ers spots as well. I don't know if it evened out but it sure seemed like one of the most extreme consistently short placements I can remember. Or put another way short spots happen, but I don't remember ever noticing a ref doing it a whole game.

[yourout]

If you had to have a TD to win a game list the top 5 current QBs you want at the helm.

My list. Right now i would have Love between 10 and 15.

1. Mahomes

2. L Jackson

3. Allen

4. Stafford

5. Geoff

 

 

 

[brewcrewdue80]

8 hours ago, LouisEly said:

They already were playing for a FG.  And Love shouldn't have made the throw anyway.

They had three red zone possessions in the first half and came away with six points.  If you want to exclude the final drive, fine, they still had a bad throw for one turnover and dropped two INTs that should have been takeaways.  Never should have come down to that kick to begin with.

 

GB had the chance to make this near identical start as the Dallas game. They very much could have been up 3 scores and have the ball. Instead it was just 6pts scored.

Carlson led to MLFs decision to go for it on 4th and 1 due to 0 confidence in him. I'm positive that's the 4th game Carlson is directly responsible for a losing outcome this season. Maybe the 5th. 

Mlf imo has consistently ignored being on the road and taking 3 pts when within chip shot range(42yds imo) by going for it on 4th downs and not converting.  Take the points. It'd have been 9-0 up 2 scores. Instead 49ers score a TD and just like that you are behind vs still ahead. But maybe again that goes on Carlson where MLF doesn't think 2 more FG attempts are going to be successful later in the game and he has to score TDs every drive.

Won that game for 90pct of it. Wasn't even a good game by Love accuracy.  A lot to build on positive. See what they can bring in through the draft and FA.

 

 

 

[HarryDoyle]

There was a 14 year gap between the last two Super Bowl victories. The good news is next year is year 14 since the Rodgers Super bowl.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

2 hours ago, Joseph Zarr said:

Heading into the 4th qtr, Love was the same Love we saw for the past 9 weeks: dominant. It looked like when he lost Tom to injury that all changed. He rushed things and it looked like he didn't trust the pocket. That 4th qtr, tho, man that was a flashback to his early-to-mid season struggles. Such a rough way to go out with that ill-advised Favre-esque throw. That one really hurt.

I don't know about that. He definitely was horrible in the 4th and hit some great throws prior to that, but he did seem a bit jumpy and off throughout the night. His first INT was also a bad throw behind the target which caused the bobble. He had a couple to that flat too that were way off. Not horrible through 3 quarters by any stretch and I thought he was "good" at half, but his 2nd half was meh. 

[Joseph Zarr]

6 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

I don't know about that. He definitely was horrible in the 4th and hit some great throws prior to that, but he did seem a bit jumpy and off throughout the night. His first INT was also a bad throw behind the target which caused the bobble. He had a couple to that flat too that were way off. Not horrible through 3 quarters by any stretch and I thought he was "good" at half, but his 2nd half was meh. 

Fair enough. I think we can agree: he was clearly the better QB until the 4th? Just a shame overall. That throw was so reminiscent of some of Favre's worst moments. PTSD? The pass to Kraft surely could have been caught by Kraft and a spade is still a spade: it was behind him. Seems a metaphor for the entire game. The Packers played to a C- overall and, yet, still 'should' have won. This is why I absolutely yearn for them to be aggressive in their off-season - within their staff especially. I know they are limited cap wise but they are very clearly already in a meaningful window. Let's treat it as such, please.

I should also say, I think the most exciting thing we have going for us at present aside from some of the obvious is the personnel staff certainly appears to be on an incredible run. What a time to have their draft capital! As a fan I am a new level if excited for this draft. I am ready for some serious @LouisElyDeeeeeep Cuts!😅

[CheezWizHed]

Was the loss on the kicker?  One Love?  On the defense?  In reality... yes. 

Carlson - Yes, he has missed many kicks this year.  But how much of it was on the long snapper?  Whelan saved an XP one a bad snap.  The missed FG wasn't as bad... but it wasn't good either. I know that there were several other snaps through the year that were at least contributors to misses. 

Offense - Yeah, not Love's best game. Not MLF's either. Love did well moving the team down the field for the first half, but no TDs. There were some questionable play calls along the path... too many play calls behind the LOS with the 49ers team speed.  Then of course, the 4th quarter had a lot of offensive struggles.  Seemed like the last INT was scripted the way the reporters talked about Love feeling like he could make throws they teach QBs not to make... and then boom. 

Defense - Played strong initially (especially the end of the half and beginning of the second), but slowly lost momentum as the game went on .  But all that faded as the 49ers came back in the 4th Quarter. Basically the same thing against the Cowboys, but we didn't have the lead to sustain the W.  All we had to do was prevent a TD at the end of the game and we didn't even make it hard.

Can't really pin that loss on only one person. 

[tmwiese55]

On 1/21/2024 at 1:16 PM, Fear The Chorizo said:

So what you're saying is quarterbacks with better arms and more natural talent can't also have a high IQ?  The 49ers did go on a good run in 2022 once Purdy became the starter, for sure, but they were a 7-4 squad with other quarterbacks before him, too and then added McCaffrey in that same timeframe. 

I think in general there are multiple ways in today's NFL to build a team capable of winning a Super Bowl any given year....but once your young quarterback is off his rookie deal regardless of where he is drafted, he better be a top 5-caliber quarterback capable of making everyone around him better instead of the other way around, or you're just not going to be good enough.  There's jealousy with the 49ers because they've had such a dominant core of talent besides quarterback that they drive fans for other teams crazy waiting for it to come crashing down after they've made some terrible decisions involving quarterbacks in free agency (Jimmy G) and the draft (Lance), then they seemingly luck into adding Purdy with a token draft pick that even they had destined for their practice squad last season and he turns out to be a competent player after their offense gets the other quarterbacks above him on the depth chart injured last season.  The flip side of that is the 49ers haven't yet won a Super Bowl since 1994 with Steve Young as their quarterback despite having rosters that appear on paper to be among the most talented overall squads in the league from 2011-2013, and from about 2019 to present.

 

Nowhere did I say that.   I'm saying people don't value it enough I would guess because its harder to know, scout, see etc.  Of course the arm talent can still have the IQ as we've seen time and again.  But often in many sports the pure physical stuff gets too much value given to it. And QB being the likely most cerebral spot in all sports it probably has more value there than in any other.  People get enamored with the Jamarcus Russell Ryan Leaf tools and forget to look at if they actually know what they're doing.     But just like you said there, they had a 30 mil FA QB and a top 5 draft pick and they didn't get the results he's getting, so the whole you can put anyone in there mindset is too far. That's really all I was getting at, the guy is good and No you can't just grab Trace McSorely and get the same results like people attacking him talk like.  Being the like 9th best QB is good, it shouldn't be mocked.  That's it, I agree with ya'll he is almost for sure not at the top top Mahomes/Rodgers/Manning level. But there is nothing wrong with being in the next group and that doesn't mean he's a fraud or sucks.   None of us who've commented here are really disagreeing or going too far in either extreme here, think we're all on the same page overall.  I'm really not talking about you, probably more the 'generic hater' type out there. And of course our bubble being GB fans and rivals is gonna be skewed with a few too many folks like that 

[BrewerFan]

23 hours ago, brewcrewdue80 said:

Carlson led to MLFs decision to go for it on 4th and 1 due to 0 confidence in him. I'm positive that's the 4th game Carlson is directly responsible for a losing outcome this season. Maybe the 5th. 

It was 4th and inches at the SF 14. I don't think any coach is kicking the FG there. 

And saying Carlson was "directly responsible," for losing the game is...ridiculous. The ball was snapped it was at a...what, 45-degree angle pointing AWAY from him in the pouring rain? 

Not on Carlson...as popular as it is to blame him. 

Also, they clearly got that 1st down...but even THAT play isn't "directly responsible," for the loss. 60 minutes of Football never comes down to 2 plays...

Though if you want to blame two plays, the dropped pick by Savage or the two missed throws on 3rd down, one that would have been an easy 1st to Jones, the other that was off Kraft and picked around mid-field would be the two.

[BrewerFan]

2 hours ago, tmwiese55 said:

 But just like you said there, they had a 30 mil FA QB and a top 5 draft pick and they didn't get the results he's getting

I'd argue they did get those results. They were a terrible DPI call away from winning a SB with Kaep. They were up in the SB before Mahomes brought them back vs Jimmy G. 

They haven't been to a SB yet with Purdy. And if you look at the previous 7 games Jimmy G played, his numbers were nearly identical to Purdy's. SF was getting hot, Garapalo got hurt, Purdy came in, McCaffery was traded for and they stayed hot.

2 hours ago, tmwiese55 said:

 I'm saying people don't value it enough I would guess because its harder to know, scout, see etc.

I think it's valued as highly as anything a QB can do...it's just NEARLY impossible to predict how that's going to translate at the NFL...and a LOT of it is coaching.

You mention Ryan Leaf. He was viewed as a cerebral QB. He was a "leader," and he was extroverted, he was intense. He made good decisions at WSU on the field. 

I think if you could tell how a QB would anticipate, how he'd read NFL defenses, how he'd be able to keep his eyes up with the pass rush coming...it'd be real easy to draft QBs.

[CheezWizHed]

3 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

...it'd be real easy to draft QBs.

Favre (not drafted, but Wolf tried), Brunell, Brooks, Rodgers, Flynn, Hasselbeck, Love... The Packers seem to do a pretty decent job.  

[BrewerFan]

On 1/21/2024 at 1:45 PM, Strike4 said:

Was just going to say the same.  I don’t think Love trusted (with good reason) Nijman to hold up against Bosa. I saw somewhere that Wallace was out the last drive and Royce Newman was in for him - which really will make you jumpy

Royce Newman was in? I didn't even notice. In the words of Collinsworth, 'now he's a guy,' who looked like a pretty nice backup Swing and just versatile OL as a rookie. Was pretty bad last year, didn't improve, and then one of the worst OL I've seen play for the Packers this year.

Him at LT is brutal. 

[BrewerFan]

1 minute ago, CheezWizHed said:

Favre (not drafted, but Wolf tried), Brunell, Brooks, Rodgers, Flynn, Hasselbeck, Love... The Packers seem to do a pretty decent job.  

Yeah, but not only is it rare, it took time to develop each and every one of those(hell, Flynn probably developed the quickest). 

Rodgers is a bust if he plays yr 1(just my opinion...with the high and tight and poor decision-making).
Love is probably closer to early Favre.

I think the biggest factor here is patience and then incredible QB coaching. Holmgren, McCarthy, and...the man who I hope retires for about 15 years and comes back one last time, the great Tom Clement.

 

[CheezWizHed]

8 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

Yeah, but not only is it rare, it took time to develop each and every one of those(hell, Flynn probably developed the quickest). 

Rodgers is a bust if he plays yr 1(just my opinion...with the high and tight and poor decision-making).
Love is probably closer to early Favre.

I think the biggest factor here is patience and then incredible QB coaching. Holmgren, McCarthy, and...the man who I hope retires for about 15 years and comes back one last time, the great Tom Clement.

 

What rookie QB doesn't take development?  Peyton Manning took time (even if he started right away).  Stroud looks good (I've not watched him), but I'll wager he made a lot of rookie mistakes. 

I do think that SO many QBs would benefit of sitting the first year or two.  I've shown it several times before that few QBs on their rookie contracts won the SB, but generally, the reason is... it takes time for them to get good enough to lead a team there. 

Watch the teams that get reactive and impatient with coaches and QBs... you'll see that they have histories of bad teams and bad QBs.  

Now clearly... there is skill needed on the QB's behalf - physical, mental, and emotional.  But at the highest level, the difference berween these guys can be small.  So letting these guys learn and grow before the bullets fly (and before the fans or reporters can tear into them) is critical to give them the best case for success.

Also, 

  

[BrewerFan]

48 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

What rookie QB doesn't take development?  Peyton Manning took time (even if he started right away).  Stroud looks good (I've not watched him), but I'll wager he made a lot of rookie mistakes. 

I do think that SO many QBs would benefit of sitting the first year or two.  I've shown it several times before that few QBs on their rookie contracts won the SB, but generally, the reason is... it takes time for them to get good enough to lead a team there. 

Watch the teams that get reactive and impatient with coaches and QBs... you'll see that they have histories of bad teams and bad QBs.  

Now clearly... there is skill needed on the QB's behalf - physical, mental, and emotional.  But at the highest level, the difference berween these guys can be small.  So letting these guys learn and grow before the bullets fly (and before the fans or reporters can tear into them) is critical to give them the best case for success.

Also, 

  

Stroud really didn't make rookie mistakes this year, but there's developing and then there's having to completely break a QB down(like Rodgers) and rebuild his entire mechanics, or Love(he was already broke down)...vs a Watson, Mahomes, Herbert, Lamar type. Dak, whoever. 

 

But Mahomes set NFL records his 2nd year and in 6 years in the league, he backed up a PB QB one year, then lost in 2 AFCCG OTs(one without touching the ball) and then played in 3 SBs.

Big difference between those QBs and Rodgers/Love.

53 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

Watch the teams that get reactive and impatient with coaches and QBs... you'll see that they have histories of bad teams and bad QBs.  

Yeah, sure, but most teams have limited patience. Sometimes it pays off(The Rams Goff/Stafford) sometimes it doesn't.

It's the benefit of not having an owner IMO. 

I don't disagree with anything else. I don't know how good Purdy is...I don't expect we'll know until SF loses Kittle, Cmac, and doesn't have 6 All-Pro's on offense. 

I won't try and convince you he's not Matt Flynn. I do know his team is going to the NFCCG on the strength of it's DL and physical style of play. Feels like we're trending in that direction. 

 

[CheezWizHed]

9 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

Stroud really didn't make rookie mistakes this year, but there's developing and then there's having to completely break a QB down(like Rodgers) and rebuild his entire mechanics, or Love(he was already broke down)...vs a Watson, Mahomes, Herbert, Lamar type. Dak, whoever. 

Dak might've come in more NFL ready than typical 4th round picks, but he clearly had a learning curve.  He splashed on the scene as a rookie, but stepped backwards for a couple years. 

Mahomes sat for a development year.  Would he have done as well as a rookie?  No idea.  But he had a year to develop, read D, see how a good QB ran the offense and did game planning.... You can't use him as "he didn't need development" when he got a whole year of it before busting on the scene.

Conversely, we really don't know what Rodgers or Love would've done as rookies.  I'm guessing it would've been a rocky road based on what we say in pre-season with them, but frankly it is only a guess. 

[tmwiese55]

19 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

I'd argue they did get those results. They were a terrible DPI call away from winning a SB with Kaep. They were up in the SB before Mahomes brought them back vs Jimmy G. 

They haven't been to a SB yet with Purdy. And if you look at the previous 7 games Jimmy G played, his numbers were nearly identical to Purdy's. SF was getting hot, Garapalo got hurt, Purdy came in, McCaffery was traded for and they stayed hot.

I think it's valued as highly as anything a QB can do...it's just NEARLY impossible to predict how that's going to translate at the NFL...and a LOT of it is coaching.

You mention Ryan Leaf. He was viewed as a cerebral QB. He was a "leader," and he was extroverted, he was intense. He made good decisions at WSU on the field. 

I think if you could tell how a QB would anticipate, how he'd read NFL defenses, how he'd be able to keep his eyes up with the pass rush coming...it'd be real easy to draft QBs.

Yup and Jimmy didn't suck either, not great at the top top level but he didn't suck.  The Kaep stuff is irrelevant, whole different team, coaches, everything and its been 10 years.   

The Jimmy SB loss was in 2019.  2020 they went 6-10, 21 10-7, then 2022 they started 7-4 before Purdy.  Since then they have lost what 3-4 games in which Purdy didn't get hurt? Can't really rip them for no SB with Purdy when he's played 1 year and got hurt in the game.  It has been a clear step up and not as easy as any idiot can step in and do it.  If he craps the bed this weekend at home, sure he has to take the heat like any qb who does that at home in a title game. But folks who've been saying he'll crap the bed also shouldn't act like it proves them right when they've been wrong like 30 weeks leading up to it.  Also, most of the elite elite guys have done it too, as we saw too many times here in GB

Yea pretty much agree on your second paragraph. I said something similar how much harder that is to scout, see, measure, etc.  Think you nailed that. Guess I'm saying now that a guy has shown he has all that it seems off to continue to slander him because he doesn't have a Jamarcus Russell cannon.  I can't believe Purdy drafted where he was can nail those very difficult deep outs dropped in between zones, but he does. Those are the real test if their arms are good enough, if they can make that throw. Or that one he had in the 4th vs us over the middle dropped into the zone. But yea as I said I'm not saying he can 'be the team' like Mahomes/Rodgers, he just doesn't have that arm talent. But he has enough of it that being super high IQ can be a good qb. It'll be interesting how he handles the contract, maybe realize his limitations and not demand 50 mil. Easy for us to say when its not our money, but there is some possibility you could end up making more by taking less, doing well, keep making that every year.  Take the big one, team goes downhill, they might cut you to get out of the contract so you lose all the non gtd money. Next thing you know you're bouncing around like your Wentz's, Jimmy, etc types.