2024-25 Milwaukee Bucks thread

[Joseph Zarr]

Sheesh I think several of you are unaware of Khash's continuing On/Off impacts even without his prime physical health. He is still very clearly a net positive influence on the basketball court. Yes, even with his inability to stay in front of a stationary folding chair (shout out to Yi), the Bucks have been a better team overall when Khris is on the court. This is backed by most every team-oriented Advanced statistic.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

46 minutes ago, Joseph Zarr said:

Sheesh I think several of you are unaware of Khash's continuing On/Off impacts even without his prime physical health. He is still very clearly a net positive influence on the basketball court. Yes, even with his inability to stay in front of a stationary folding chair (shout out to Yi), the Bucks have been a better team overall when Khris is on the court. This is backed by most every team-oriented Advanced statistic.

The problem is being on the court. It's a huge problem.

[LouisEly]

ESPN Research has opponents shooting 42.7% against Kuzma, which ranks in the 25 lowest shooting % against among players with at least 250 shots attempted against.

Not sure if that's consistent with his career, but opponents who Kuzma is guarding don't have a high shooting % this season.

[bigred]

5 hours ago, nate82 said:

I think they are preparing to not make the playoffs and are starting the sell off early.  Probably will hear that Giannis will want out after this season.

Probably will go cheap for next year with a massive sell off of Giannis and Dame.  Though this rebuild will take a long time to fulfill.  Probably looking at a 5-10 year rebuild.

Giannis isn't going anywhere. 

[Samurai Bucky]

Bucks are also getting Jericho Sims from the Knicks.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2025/02/knicks-to-trade-jericho-sims-to-bucks.html

[patrickgpe]

Love the Martin for Beauchamp trade. He hasn’t been able to get on the floor for the bucks and Martin is getting 10 ppg. I’d assume his player option next year is declined and he will be a free agent next year, so it’s a rental but this helps them make a run this year 

[Samurai Bucky]

Does it seem like they are freeing up space for buyout candidates?  I thought they did something like that in the past, but am not well versed on that.  I had read they were freeing up roster spots.

[patrickgpe]

1 hour ago, Samurai Bucky said:

Does it seem like they are freeing up space for buyout candidates?  I thought they did something like that in the past, but am not well versed on that.  I had read they were freeing up roster spots.

Not sure they have that much room, I’m assuming they will sign Rollins to a full contract with the small savings and roster space they added 

[LouisEly]

4 hours ago, patrickgpe said:

Love the Martin for Beauchamp trade. He hasn’t been able to get on the floor for the bucks and Martin is getting 10 ppg. I’d assume his player option next year is declined and he will be a free agent next year, so it’s a rental but this helps them make a run this year 

ESPN says Beauchamp was traded for Kevin Porter Jr..  Porter missed 23-24 but in 22-23 averaged over 19ppg for HOU.

Also saying Baldwin and cash to the Spurs.

[Matt Breen]

Gone: Khris Middleton (thank you!), Delon Wright, MarJon Beauchamp, AJ Johnson

Additions: Jericho Sims, Kevin Porter Jr., Kyle Kuzma

Are we better? I think so. A healthy Middleton is - hands down - the best player in this bunch. But it looks like the club - and the players - know Khris isn't up to snuff. I haven't watched a lot of games, but he looks like a liability on defense. And just not knowing his health is difficult.

Kuzma had been made fun of a lot on the Internet. But some he has some value. Many think he's been miscast as a big scorer. He's more of a #3-4 option - which is what he will be asked of in Milwaukee. And he was known to be adequate defensively - although I'm not sure where he is at now. I'm guessing the club feels they can get him back to that sort of a role now that he's off a losing club.

In the end, this club can only do so much due to their financial limitations. And let's face it - you have Giannis. You optimize these windows of opportunity. I don't think anyone thought we were going to win with Middleton. I think (and hope) we can improve with Kuzma, Porter and Sims. We have half a season for this team to gel. Let's hope for the best.

[patrickgpe]

10 hours ago, LouisEly said:

ESPN says Beauchamp was traded for Kevin Porter Jr..  Porter missed 23-24 but in 22-23 averaged over 19ppg for HOU.

Also saying Baldwin and cash to the Spurs.

sorry you are right kevin porter, not kevin martin. Checkered past, but did put up good numbers in the past. he is getting 10 ppg this year as a backup. Beauchamp can't get on the court so its a good move. 

[LouisEly]

On 2/5/2025 at 4:04 PM, LouisEly said:

ESPN Research has opponents shooting 42.7% against Kuzma, which ranks in the 25 lowest shooting % against among players with at least 250 shots attempted against.

Not sure if that's consistent with his career, but opponents who Kuzma is guarding don't have a high shooting % this season.

Among 315 players who have played at least 30 games this season, Kuzma has the 294th lowest effective FG% against him and Porter has the 305th lowest.

Guys they guard aren't shooting well against them this year.

[Joseph Zarr]

A day removed from the Deadline. Any emotions subsided.

Core thoughts:

• I absolutely hate to see Midds' career go the arc of the hobbled vet 'Show the young guys how it's done' leg of his career on a perennial loser of an org. Granted, Warshington has made efforts to improved their basketball ops on both the Wizards and Mystics side - I grant them that.
• Really don't like losing AJ Johnson in the Midds deal. Just do not like it. Having watched the Herd off and on throughout their season, Johnson's light began to turn on in the past few weeks. He can legitimately beat pretty much any man cover 1 v 1. That's a huge asset. This being said, his overall offensive game is at best a 50/50 proposition. He put up some of the most ungodly bad numbers in the pre-season. His numbers certainly didn't improve enough in the G-League. He is still likely years away from realistically making an impact in the NBA. BUT, regardless, that's a massive lotto pick grab for the Wizards. And, I have an extremely hard time believing this was the Bucks plan exiting the draft.
• This gets me to: I struggle to see a clear vision for this Bucks team. I think this speaks to a convoluted decision-making process across the org. I have no inside information to back this claim. BUT, I lived through the Kohl years. Their ongoing process stinks of too many voices in the room. I see a GM who appears to be consistently over-ridden by ownership and now a highly-paid coach - the third coach on their payroll. This doesn't even get to GM Giannis. I just think it's a dysfunctional process across the board and I see it in the draft and in how this deadline played out.
• I continue to have a very hard time seeing Pat, Bobby and Brook all on this team post-deadline. And, well, here we are. Is what it is.
• I think over-investing in some vision whereby Kyle Kuzma turns back the clock to his Laker days is quite a bit pie in the sky thinking. Could it happen? Sure. Do I hope it happens? Absolutely. I think his offensive numbers this season are skewed because of a disconnect but it's poor form to think those offensive numbers aren't what they are: extremely poor. I think he can be a plus defender and a plus rebounder. But, I struggle to embrace his overall sub-par career percentages from distance. I struggle embracing the massive loss of efficiency and shooting productivity with Midds out the door. I hope he surprises. That's all I have there. But, in the end, I can't help but think the move as an objective move just speaks to another vintage Bucks maneuver where they waited til the last minute and immensely devalued a one time premium asset. And, they had to over-pay to do it because they had already crippled themselves beyond the second apron. It's very fair to say: it is flat out poor process all the way around.
• I don't over invest in any of the hoopla around KPJ's off the court issues. I have no idea what happened. It is reported he is still under investigation but there is no resolution and I was not there. So, I won't virtue signal any part of this story whatsoever like many many other fans are doing and have done. Basketball-wise, I think KPJ is extremely talented and continues to have untapped potential. He is a measurably (and I do mean measurably) better basketball player than Marjon. He has length, top-tier athleticism, and an extremely good handle. He could very easily step into a back-up PG role for the second unit - or share those duties should they sign Rollins to an actual contract. As a player for player swap, all outside distractions and concerns aside, this is a massive basketball win for the Bucks.
• I like the Jericho Sims maneuver. We have lacked a true athlete at the 5 (outside of Giannis, obviously) - back-up or starter - in quite some time. He is young, has massive hops, and can defend some. Offensively, this is a poor man's Gadz. However, you could do much worse in this department and I think he can offer some minutes - likely in the single digits or bordering low double digits. I doubt he's a regular rotation player but he can fill in.
• IF I were to honestly opine on the best value deal in this entire deadline I'm going beyond all these deals and easily choosing the swap of Hugo Besson for Mathias Lessort. In a vacuum, this is the best value-for-value win. Will Lessort ever come stateside? Likely no. He also is recovering from a major leg injury from this past year and isn't currently playing. But, as someone who has a pulse on Euro ball, Lessort is absolutely the best offensive rebounder on the French National team. He is a bit of a man beast and a vastly underrated player as a whole. Let me put it plainly: IF he came over, Lessort would very very much play minutes at the 4 next season for the Bucks and I would not blink. He is 29 years old, however. IF he did (and, again, it's a big if) they maybe get 2-3 years out of him. But, as a raw swap for an undersized guard who isn't really an NBA-caliber talent it's a pound for pound pure win of a maneuver.
• Nothing left to do but see how this all plays out. The Bucks moved under the second apron but didn't really do anything with that maneuverability for now. As a whole, I give their deadline a C-. Hope it all works out.

[GAME05]

Middleton won't be gone long. He's definitely a buyout candidate next year and can come back to the Bucks for a farewell couple of months.

[nate82]

I think after this season it will be interesting what this team does.  Do they tear it down or do they try and get a 3rd superstar?  Will Giannis request a trade if they don’t improve?

[sveumrules]

26 minutes ago, nate82 said:

I think after this season it will be interesting what this team does.  Do they tear it down or do they try and get a 3rd superstar?  Will Giannis request a trade if they don’t improve?

Think it'll pretty much come down to how the playoffs play out.

With CLE, BOS and NYK all clearly ahead of them their realistic ceiling right now is the 2nd round.

Bounce in the first? Prolly see big changes.

Make it to the ECF or make a surprise Finals run? Horst prolly keeps his job to give it one more shot.

[nate82]

28 minutes ago, sveumrules said:

Think it'll pretty much come down to how the playoffs play out.

With CLE, BOS and NYK all clearly ahead of them their realistic ceiling right now is the 2nd round.

Bounce in the first? Prolly see big changes.

Make it to the ECF or make a surprise Finals run? Horst prolly keeps his job to give it one more shot.

If they are bounced from the first round I could see Giannis saying enough and demanding a trade.  As bad as that sounds I think it is probably the right direction for the franchise to go.

The only thing with Giannis is that there are not that many teams you could trade him to.  I thought Golden State would be that team but they traded and signed Butler to a new contract.  I don't think they are a realistic destination now. 

The only other team I can think of is a three team trade between the Bucks Suns and another team.  Bucks receive picks and an expiring contract.  The Suns would receive Giannis and the third team would receive Durant. 

Dame I think probably goes to Miami for expiring and picks.  The only thing that is going to suck is that these  picks are going to be in the 15-20+ range.  Yeah the Bucks will get multiple of these picks but ouch that is going to hurt to lose Dame, Middleton and Giannis for picks in the 15-20+ range. 

I just don't believe Giannis will want to stick around for a rebuild.  He has said in the past he wants the team to be improving and I just don't see him wanting to stay around with a team that is a maybe a 8-10 seed in the playoffs.  He will want to be on a team that is more of a championship contender and not a maybe we make the playoffs team.

[HarryDoyle]

On 2/6/2025 at 5:19 PM, patrickgpe said:

Love the Martin for Beauchamp trade. He hasn’t been able to get on the floor for the bucks and Martin is getting 10 ppg. I’d assume his player option next year is declined and he will be a free agent next year, so it’s a rental but this helps them make a run this year 

They're not making a run. It most likely will be a first round exit no matter how many trades they make. 

[GAME05]

While I doubt ownership would give Giannis the Middleton treatment and instead realize the value of a HOFer as a career-long Buck, I'm in agreement with you guys that "as long as they're trying to contend" more likely means "as long as we're Championship contenders". But even without our own draft picks, I'm optimistic we'll be fine if we really have to rebuild just on the trade values of Lillard and especially Giannis.

WITH Bobby Portis the Bucks are looking at being $29M below the 1st apron next year and $41M below the second apron. I could see Portis being traded in the offseason solely for the need of a SG and being too deep at PF. And the only 5 of note who'll be a FA is Myles Turner.

[LouisEly]

On 2/7/2025 at 3:00 PM, nate82 said:

Yeah the Bucks will get multiple of these picks but ouch that is going to hurt to lose Dame, Middleton and Giannis for picks in the 15-20+ range. 

If you look at the top four scorers in the league:

SG-A (#11 overall)
Giannis (#15 overall)
Jokic (2nd round)
Maxey (#21 overall)

Add to Jalen Brunson (2nd) and most of the top MVP candidates this season could have been had or are very close to that 15-20+ range. 

[Joseph Zarr]

Let me state the obvious:

Giannis missing the next 2-3 weeks with the calf strain is going to hurt the Bucks playoff chances.

 

They are going to need Kuzma and Porter Jr. to play well and more efficient than they have, well, ever in their careers. The season outlook, already bleak, just took another one to the chin. Ouch.

[sveumrules]

7 minutes ago, Joseph Zarr said:

Let me state the obvious:

Giannis missing the next 2-3 weeks with the calf strain is going to hurt the Bucks playoff chances.

 

They are going to need Kuzma and Porter Jr. to play well and more efficient than they have, well, ever in their careers. The season outlook, already bleak, just took another one to the chin. Ouch.

Bucks are two games up on the #7 seed (Heat/Hawks tied at .500) and six point five games up on the #10 seed (Bulls). Giannis missing two three weeks might push them closer to the play in, but the odds of them dropping out completely are pretty slim.

The season outlook is almost entirely dependent on the playoffs for me. Giannis getting hurt now, when he'll miss fewer games on account of the All Star break and should be able to return for the last month / 20 games or so before the playoffs, is about as ideal as it gets from a timeline perspective.

[Joseph Zarr]

Me waiting for the vaunted 'Jericho Sims Era':

[nate82]

Ummm no one talking about that pathetic showing by Jackson in the dunk contest?  Good because it was absolutely horrendous and should be forgotten forever.

[OldHeidelberg]

Portis suspended 25 games for violating substance policy. Tramadol, he says it was an accident.