2024-25 Misc Offseason News

[Frisbee Slider]

32 minutes ago, Devinep said:

When was the last time a team in the bottom half of payroll won the World Series? 

2017 Astros had 17th highest payroll and won WS

2024 Diamondbacks made it to WS with #20 payroll 

2020 Rays made it to WS with #28 payroll

[Frisbee Slider]

1 hour ago, Devinep said:

Sounds a lot better than certain teams having zero chance at the best players after arbitration

Signing players after arbitration to long term contracts typically means signing someone who is past their prime and will not live up to their contract. 

Granted, if you have a high payroll you can better absorb these mistakes. in most cases, it is still an suboptimal decision. 
We shouldn’t want to sign players who are past their prime to long term contracts.

 

1 hour ago, Devinep said:

I consider competitive balance to be a team having success being determined by being better at trading, scouting and developing players.

Maybe 🤷‍♂️

I think the league wide outcome in that scenario is a boring product. 

 

[Devinep]

27 minutes ago, Frisbee Slider said:

Signing players after arbitration to long term contracts typically means signing someone who is past their prime and will not live up to their contract. 

Granted, if you have a high payroll you can better absorb these mistakes. It most cases, it is still an suboptimal decision. 
We shouldn’t want to sign players who are past their prime to long term contracts.

 

Maybe 🤷‍♂️

I think the league wide outcome in that scenario is a boring product. 

 

Yes I am aware that free agency is after arbitration and guys are older. It’s in no way good for the game that only like 4 team has a legit chance to sign Ohtani or Soto and they were all big markets. The Brewers havent even rumored to be making any attempt at Bregman despite him being the top player at a desperate position of need.

[Devinep]

39 minutes ago, Frisbee Slider said:

2017 Astros had 17th highest payroll and won WS

2024 Diamondbacks made it to WS with #20 payroll 

2020 Rays made it to WS with #28 payroll

I said World Series winners, not just participants. She me 1995, exactly 3 WS winners were not in the top 1/2 of the league in payroll. $ making it easy to win isn’t really a debate after this research and after the dodgers won the WS then went on to buy a bunch more talent, not to mention give more $ to their own talent before free agency 

 

https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/to-win-a-world-series-teams-almost-always-have-to-spend/

[Frisbee Slider]

42 minutes ago, Devinep said:

$ making it easy to win isn’t really a debate after this research

I don’t think anyone would disagree that having more money makes it easier to win. On a microlevel, many specific long term free agent signings are just poor decisions.

Three WS winners in past 30 years from bottom half of payroll rankings is eye opening. I still don’t think I’d want the MLB to turn itself into the NFL.

[umphrey]

If they kill competitive balance then they also kill the regular season and people only pay attention for the playoffs. I think that’s inevitable at this point though and may have already happened. 

[Frisbee Slider]

14 minutes ago, umphrey said:

If they kill competitive balance then they also kill the regular season and people only pay attention for the playoffs. I think that’s inevitable at this point though and may have already happened. 

There isn’t a lot of pain in this recent article 

https://www.mlb.com/amp/press-release/press-release-mlb-finishes-2024-season-with-highest-attendance-in-seven-years.html

[markedman5]

Thought this was interesting…….in 2023…….the Dodgers payroll was higher than the Brewers revenue……….

 

[Playing Catch]

14 hours ago, markedman5 said:

Thought this was interesting…….in 2023…….the Dodgers payroll was higher than the Brewers revenue……….

 

Firstly, I'm not sure how Forbes gets its data. I don't believe the public is privy to revenue totals. Secondly, having revenue numbers without cost numbers, waters down the intended effect.

I already posted in the Brewers Payroll thread, but clearly this was the better spot to mention that having NFL-style parity is not at all interesting to me. I like having SOME disparity between the Evil Empire(s) and the underdogs. That is the root of all the drama! But make no mistake, the current competitive imbalance is unsustainable.

Hypothetically, the Brewers beating the Mariners in the World Series doesn't compare with the Brewers beating the Yankees.

[wallus]

Cubs were runner up on Scott so at least he isn't in the division 

[markedman5]

NFL style parity is very interesting to me…….unfortunately I don’t think I will live long enough to see it.

[jay87shot]

2 hours ago, wallus said:

Cubs were runner up on Scott so at least he isn't in the division 

I give it 48 hours before they sign Estevez (or maybe Kirby Yates/David Robertson)

[ClosetBrewerFan]

The Forbes valuations are interesting. No way are the Yankees bringing in $130M more in revenue than the Dodgers.  That cannot be correct. Dodgers have the largest broadcasting contract and plenty of ticket revenue. 

It also needs to be pointed out that MLB teams have other operating expenses but it would be surprising if those costs were dramatically different from team to team.  For example, the difference between revenue and payroll for the Brewers is $167M.  I could see their other expenses could be well over $100M (taxes, non-player salaries, MiLB costs, stadium costs, training facilities, debt payments, etc).  But the Yankees have $363M delta between payroll and revenue. No way the Yankees operating costs are $200M more than Brewers.  They must be making a lot more in profit.

[markedman5]

 

[nate82]

2 hours ago, markedman5 said:

 

That eliminates another team for Alonso and Bregman, probably more so Alonso than Bregman here. 

 

4 hours ago, markedman5 said:

NFL style parity is very interesting to me…….unfortunately I don’t think I will live long enough to see it.

I don't want to see anything like the NFL style parity as it is just stale and boring.  I haven't watched a full NFL game in about 10 years now the game is just way too boring now and there really isn't much of a difference between the top and bottom teams other than QB and/or coaching.  If the MLB were to go the parity route I would prefer something like the NHL or NBA.  Just make the salary ceiling a bit lower and increase the penalties for going over and add a salary floor around $100mm. 

[wallus]

It's a little surprising that Bregman hasn't signed yet. Perhaps some team will sign him to a 3 year deal with a higher AAV with some deferrals that really could use a 3B.

[sveumrules]

24 minutes ago, wallus said:

It's a little surprising that Bregman hasn't signed yet. Perhaps some team will sign him to a 3 year deal with a higher AAV with some deferrals that really could use a 3B.

There was something on MLBTR a few days back about how Boras/Bregman are still focused on a long term deal.

I can see why teams have been hesitant to this point.

Gets a lot of his value from pulling homers to the short porch in HOU, has seen his wRC+ drop from 137 to 126 to 118 the last three years, walk rate fell off a cliff from 13.8% over 2018-23 down to a not so nice 6.9% in 2024.

Apparently turned down something like Chapman money (6/150) before the Astros pivoted to trading for Paredes and signing Walker.

Starting to look like another guy where Boras misread the market.

[brewmann04]

baseball needs a high and low cap to give a fair playing field.

but MLB will never agree to it.

[TURBO]

15 minutes ago, brewmann04 said:

baseball needs a high and low cap to give a fair playing field.

but MLB will never agree to it.

MLB might, but I doubt the players ever will...

[markedman5]

4 hours ago, nate82 said:

That eliminates another team for Alonso and Bregman, probably more so Alonso than Bregman here. 

 

I don't want to see anything like the NFL style parity as it is just stale and boring.  I haven't watched a full NFL game in about 10 years now the game is just way too boring now and there really isn't much of a difference between the top and bottom teams other than QB and/or coaching.  If the MLB were to go the parity route I would prefer something like the NHL or NBA.  Just make the salary ceiling a bit lower and increase the penalties for going over and add a salary floor around $100mm. 

Agree to disagree on the parity…….i love the idea that the Packers can keep their best players and pay them at the top of the market when warranted. Ditto for the Bucks.
 

I like the idea of organizations succeeding and failing based on good management and not just who can afford to buy the best players. The Dodgers are very well run……which combined with their economic advantages is just not good for the sport. IMO

The Brewers have done a great job of doing what they can to compete……..the fact that they have outperformed the Cubs and Cards is to their credit…….but the big markets can afford to things the small markets can only dream of in this current climate…….I’d much prefer competing on a level playing field……or as close to one as we can get.

[DR28]

What a ******* joke................ Now Dodgers sign Kirby Yates.

[Frisbee Slider]

53 minutes ago, DR28 said:

What a ******* joke................ Now Dodgers sign Kirby Yates.

I’m genuinely less bothered by someone signing a 38 year old reliever who was barely above replacement level from 2020 to 2023 (due to injury). Yates had a nice bounce back year in 2024 but age could easily cause a regression.

[TURBO]

44 minutes ago, Frisbee Slider said:

I’m genuinely less bothered by someone signing a 38 year old reliever who was barely above replacement level from 2020 to 2023 (due to injury). Yates had a nice bounce back year in 2024 but age could easily cause a regression.

Or not...

Why make excuses, the Dodgers are taking over, and everyone seems to be fine with it.

I hope you guys enjoy seeing the Dodgers win another 3 or 4 rings in the next few years.  This is as close to a juggernaut/dynasty that we've seen in a while in MLB.

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[TURBO]

1 hour ago, DR28 said:

What a ******* joke................ Now Dodgers sign Kirby Yates.

It's to the point now where they should be embarrassed, but nope, they just keep on adding guys.

Bregman or Alonso next?

Flaherty?

[SeaBass]

Shouldn't we be rooting for the Dodgers to continue signing literally everyone? Eventually other owners will tire of it and demand changes. Fans will likely disconnect from the sport as well.

The Mets will probably join them with Cohen's wealth propelling them. They're just getting started under Stearns and while I made a joke when the Mets signed Soto that they didn't need Stearns to make that move he will keep the team in line by knowing which guys to stay away from, like Pete Alonso. There's a guy the Mets absolutely would have thrown too much money at before Stearns got there.