Game 6 - Cowboys @ Packers - Sunday, Oct. 18th @ 7:20 PM

[homer]

3 hours ago, homer said:

I get protecting the QB (because who wants to watch Tyrod Taylor) but it's getting to the point where any time there's a sack you are surprised there isn't a roughing call.

And then there's Jalen Hurts. Oof. Somebody on their training/medical staff should probably get canned for that one.

[Fear The Chorizo]

If the NFL is adamant about protecting quarterbacks to the level they appear to be, there needs to be several modifications/points of emphasis on these rules to give defenses a chance to play defense within the rules - my suggestions:

 

1 - Once a quarterback breaks the pocket and reaches a point where he could scramble or pass, he should become the same as any other ball carrier in terms of roughing/late hit rules.  No glancing hand to the helmet as he is either faking a pass or running by a lineman should draw a flag, and as long as the defender doesn't drive him to the ground on a pass attempt contact up to a full count after the throw should be allowable as long as he's not diving at knees.

 

2 - Make roughing calls reviewable plays - let the refs keep trying to make these judgement calls, but then give a team's coach the option to challenge the call and have New York review the play to see if it should be deemed personal foul call.  If contact is inadvertent or the replay doesn't show egregious after the play contact, the flag should get picked up.

 

3 - Make flag-baiting by quarterbacks eligible for 15-yr penalty/loss of down, also.

 

4 - Establish a tiered penalty system for these calls.  Similar to running into/roughing the kicker penalties, there should be levels of roughing the passer administered, especially if it's not a reviewable penalty/play.  Inadvertent hand on the helmet flagged?  5 yards, repeat the down.  Obvious late hit or deliberate shot at the knees while not engaged with a lineman?  15 yards, 1st down.

They won't admit publicly....but the NFL has a growing problem on its hands with quality of the game right now, and it's not going to get any better - they're going to point to growing revenue streams overseas, which they honestly have to keep doing because the US market is already oversaturated on football, IMO. 

[kestrel79]

Some of those Roughing the Pass calls against us were so insane, especially after how many times Love has been teed off on so far this year with almost 0 calls. It's a bad look and looks rigged.

[Jopal78]

48 minutes ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

If the NFL is adamant about protecting quarterbacks to the level they appear to be, there needs to be several modifications/points of emphasis on these rules to give defenses a chance to play defense within the rules - my suggestions:

 

1 - Once a quarterback breaks the pocket and reaches a point where he could scramble or pass, he should become the same as any other ball carrier in terms of roughing/late hit rules.  No glancing hand to the helmet as he is either faking a pass or running by a lineman should draw a flag, and as long as the defender doesn't drive him to the ground on a pass attempt contact up to a full count after the throw should be allowable as long as he's not diving at knees.

 

2 - Make roughing calls reviewable plays - let the refs keep trying to make these judgement calls, but then give a team's coach the option to challenge the call and have New York review the play to see if it should be deemed personal foul call.  If contact is inadvertent or the replay doesn't show egregious after the play contact, the flag should get picked up.

 

3 - Make flag-baiting by quarterbacks eligible for 15-yr penalty/loss of down, also.

 

4 - Establish a tiered penalty system for these calls.  Similar to running into/roughing the kicker penalties, there should be levels of roughing the passer administered, especially if it's not a reviewable penalty/play.  Inadvertent hand on the helmet flagged?  5 yards, repeat the down.  Obvious late hit or deliberate shot at the knees while not engaged with a lineman?  15 yards, 1st down.

They won't admit publicly....but the NFL has a growing problem on its hands with quality of the game right now, and it's not going to get any better - they're going to point to growing revenue streams overseas, which they honestly have to keep doing because the US market is already oversaturated on football, IMO. 

They called it correctly. Van Ness took more than one step after the ball left Prescott’s hand then gave him a shove. 
 

Rule 12, Sec. 2, Article 11 provides that a pass rusher is responsible for knowing when the ball leaves the passer’s hand. Roughing the passer will be called if the pass rusher makes direct contact with the passer after his first step (prior to his second step hitting the ground) once the ball has left the passer’s hand, and the pass rusher must be making an attempt to avoid contact. 

That Van Ness shoved him instead of leveling him doesn’t make it less of a personal foul under the rules.

They should do away with the “Rules Experts” on the broadcasts. Most of them probably haven’t picked up the rule book in years. Just more blathering to fill every second of space in the broadcast to keep you from losing interest. 
 

The NFL remains the dominant attraction on TV in the United States. Viewership is up modestly since last year, while traditional TV continues to decline. Their product’s reputation and popularity has been impervious to decades of revelations about traumatic brain injuries, drugs, domestic violence, and criminal misconduct. 

[homer]

"shove" 

The rule needs to change. 

[Jopal78]

3 hours ago, homer said:

"shove" 

The rule needs to change. 

That is the point. The actual rule says “direct contact”.  

I suppose it’s possible Van Ness doesn’t know the definition of the word “contact”, but more likely than not he does, and merely judged he wouldn’t get flagged. That type of judgement is why the rule is there in the first place. 

[LouisEly]

I'd argue that it's rather difficult for a 280+ lb person to stop themselves when running full-speed in one step.

And trying to avoid the QB is a good way to blow out a knee.

[JosephC]

7 hours ago, kestrel79 said:

Some of those Roughing the Pass calls against us were so insane, especially after how many times Love has been teed off on so far this year with almost 0 calls. It's a bad look and looks rigged.

I think it was.  Not rigged to affect the outcome of the game, but rigged in trying to keep the game close enough where people would keep watching.

If some fluke things would have happened that would have later cost the Packers the game...well what's the big deal?  Team win, team lose.  As long as the TV partners stay happy and the money keeps rolling in, that's really all that matters.

[Jopal78]

1 hour ago, LouisEly said:

I'd argue that it's rather difficult for a 280+ lb person to stop themselves when running full-speed in one step.

And trying to avoid the QB is a good way to blow out a knee.

QBs are the face of the game, so to protect them the NFL wrote a super broad rule which the refs could call on every play where the QB is contacted after the ball has left his hand. 

[Yaz]

Remember some of the calls against Clay Matthews? 

 

9 hours ago, kestrel79 said:

Some of those Roughing the Pass calls against us were so insane, especially after how many times Love has been teed off on so far this year with almost 0 calls. It's a bad look and looks rigged.

[da swedish german]

I just really love insurance, weight loss, ED, and political commercials 

great product

[OldSchoolSnapper]

8 hours ago, JosephC said:

I think it was.  Not rigged to affect the outcome of the game, but rigged in trying to keep the game close enough where people would keep watching.

If some fluke things would have happened that would have later cost the Packers the game...well what's the big deal?  Team win, team lose.  As long as the TV partners stay happy and the money keeps rolling in, that's really all that matters.

Yeah, you will never get me to believe that there is not some level of rigging in these games. I don't think it's "make sure Green Bay wins" or "make sure Watson gets the over on 120 yards" but I absolutely believe the league has an edict of "your whistle can be a tool to keep things competitive sometimes" stated in less direct terms.

[homer]

10 hours ago, LouisEly said:

I'd argue that it's rather difficult for a 280+ lb person to stop themselves when running full-speed in one step.

And trying to avoid the QB is a good way to blow out a knee.

I would also argue it's hard not to lead with your helmet as it's attached to your head which is on top of your body.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

28 minutes ago, homer said:

I would also argue it's hard not to lead with your helmet as it's attached to your head which is on top of your body.

I often wonder how many issues could be solved by getting rid of helmets entirely. I understand it's a hot take but the helmet gives players from youth leagues all the way up a great level of comfort in turning their whole being into a missile. It is the hammer and the nail on a football field, awful for both the tackler and the tacklee. The old-time leather helmets seem like a better piece of equipment than what we have. The helmet is also what's causing the "pebble in a can" effect on the brain.

[homer]

2 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

I often wonder how many issues could be solved by getting rid of helmets entirely. I understand it's a hot take but the helmet gives players from youth leagues all the way up a great level of comfort in turning their whole being into a missile. It is the hammer and the nail on a football field, awful for both the tackler and the tacklee. The old-time leather helmets seem like a better piece of equipment than what we have. The helmet is also what's causing the "pebble in a can" effect on the brain.

That has actually been floated as a way to stop concussions. Sounds counterintuitive I know. I remember my freshman football coach telling us "You could literally run into a wall and be fine."

[SeaBass]

11 hours ago, LouisEly said:

I'd argue that it's rather difficult for a 280+ lb person to stop themselves when running full-speed in one step.

And trying to avoid the QB is a good way to blow out a knee.

I remember watching the replay and feeling like LVN could have avoided doing what he did. He didn't need to put his arms out and then clearly push Dak.

I still hated the flag though, it's just a really soft interpretation of the rule but at the same time I kind of understood it. I was still more mad at the ref than the player.

Pretty conflicting thoughts and emotions is all I have to offer I guess.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

I'll say this about the Packers; if you gave me ST, pass offense/defense, rush offense/defense, and asked me which one I'd like to suck at, I'd pick rush offense if I had to choose. It's the one that has the best chance of progressing over the course of the year.

[OldHeidelberg]

The downfield passing game is certainly something to hang our hats on. It reminds me of a couple of the later Rodgers seasons when he had Jordy and Adams, the legit threat to successfully chuck it down there anytime should really open up the run and underneath game if we can find players who can do it. Of course, we need to pass block to get the players downfield but Love has really started to excel the last couple of weeks in buying just enough time.