Alternatives for shortstop?

[TwinsBrewersWorldSeries]

http://www.rotoworld.com/...px?id=3333&sport=MLB

 

Had two very solid years in 2006 and 2008. We probably could get him for $2-3 million. Good plate discipline and excellent defense up the middle. Thoughts?

Twins declined his option for 2011 (they just signed that Japanese SS Phenom), so he's a FA

[rickh150]

Did Hardy just get traded? I wouldn't mind having him back for the right price.

[strawbossisevil]

After looking at that list...yuck. Not a single appealing option. I'd be tempted to give Luis Cruz a chance in Spring Training to earn some playing time, especially the way he has been absolutely raking in Winter ball. Given the chance, his numbers might not be all that different from any of those listed options.

 

Part of the problems with the calculations being made is that none of those guys are spring chickens. The odds are that their defensive range is likely to go down from last season.

 

I wouldn't be opposed to signing a Punto or Counsell though. I think our best option for improvement at SS will be later in the season at the trade deadline.

 

Next offseason there may be a host of solid SS available in FA (assuming they don't sign a deal during the course of this season). Rollins, Reyes, Bartlett, Hardy, Infante, Furcal (possibly), Scutaro. Some of these might become available at the deadline this season.

[southpaw121505]

Crap, I had a long post and lost it before submitting it. Long story short, we need to trade for a guy blocked that is a better defender and gets on base more than 30% of the time. I found some guys but I'm sure most of them wouldn't happen for some reason or another, just some somewhat realistic names to consider:

 

Jamey Carrol- LAD, 1 year remaining at 1.8.

Macier Izturis- LAA, 2 years- 3.1, 3.8

Emilio Bonifacio- FLA, cheap- pre arby (not sure about his D at SS though)

Jed Lowrie or Marco Scutaro- BOS

[igor67]

One advantage of rearranging parts and ending up with one really good player and one really bad one is that it makes improvement on the rally bad player much easier. For a team in the 90 win range the marginal value of 1 win is huge. Fangraphs for last season has Cabrera and Renteria as being worth 1.3 WAR last year and Punto at 1.4. Punto as a SS is a lot more palatable than the Twins running him out as a 3rd basemen a whole bunch. Given how far they've gone, and the fairly minimal cost Doug needs to get 1 of those 3 and put Betancourt on the bench. An ideal solution is probably to cut Betancourt and get Counsell and one of the other 3, but I think then your starting to chase some moderate improvements in the bench. Bottomline though the Brewers offense isn't so great if can afford to carry more complete black holes and sub .300 OBPs, but more importantly you can't try to sabotage the pitching staff with what just might be a historically bad infield defense.

[endaround]

Keep in mind that Renteria's WAR is based only on 72 games. Meaning if you give him 120 games he'd be over 2. But he only played 72 due to injury.

[endaround]

Did Hardy just get traded? I wouldn't mind having him back for the right price.

Hardy got moved to Baltimore. Now bringing back Hardy next year for what Betancourt is costing is foreseeable.

[wishicouldhit]

There is always the option of staying in house: Cruz would be good on D, tryout Ferris at SS, or resign counsell. These options would be cheap. Financial flexibility at the deadline in case of injuries is a must.

[wallus]

Does Toronto have any decent shortstops we could expect from the Villy trade?

[Bombers]

What about Jeter, I hear he is available?

[derflotr]

I like the Punto idea.

[Kelbysdaddy]

isnt felipe lopez available? i liked him a couple years ago.

[logan82]

This is a thread about getting a SS. That guy can barely play a passable 2B.

[colbyjack]

Since Scutaro was brought up, weren't the Red Sox rumored to be willing to basically give him and his contract away earlier this offseason? I agree that Punto would be a good target, and the easier route would be to just re-sign Counsell, but Scutaro could be had relatively easily.

 

Melvin deserves a lot of credit for acquiring Greinke and Marcum, but I agree that how he handles shortstop after the acquisition of Betancourt could be another big feather in his cap this offseason.

[DocLuna7]

Since Scutaro was brought up, weren't the Red Sox rumored to be willing to basically give him and his contract away earlier this offseason? I agree that Punto would be a good target, and the easier route would be to just re-sign Counsell, but Scutaro could be had relatively easily.

 

Melvin deserves a lot of credit for acquiring Greinke and Marcum, but I agree that how he handles shortstop after the acquisition of Betancourt could be another big feather in his cap this offseason.

I would love Scutaro. Without being fully informed as to Boston's depth, does anyone see a potential match anywhere?

[chadomac]

Marco Scutaro and Mike Cameron, please. That'll help fix the holes that the Greinke trade made.

[TooLiveBrew]

The Sawx would probably have to eat a lot of those salaries to make that happen, but I'd love to see those two added as well.

[wcswimmer712]

What about Cesar Izturis? Seeing as the Orioles just traded for J.J. Hardy will he become expendable?

He may not be the best hitter (.256/.296/.323 over 10 seasons), but he is a phenomenal fielder. Only committed 9 errors in 151 games last year, last three years he's at 9, 10, and 6 defensive runs above average. From what I remember seeing him in STL, he has a cannon for an arm. Just another name to consider. I'd much rather take JJ Hardy back but I highly doubt that will happen.

[ELCABALLO45]

I want nothing to do with Punto.

 

My first choice would be Renteria

[ilikewisco]

Can Keppinger play short? if he were a decent glove he would fit exactly what the Brewers need. Let him and Betancourt fight it out for the starting SS and the other is utility. Add Counsel to that and we have bases covered.

[paulmolitor4]

Can Keppinger play short? if he were a decent glove he would fit exactly what the Brewers need. Let him and Betancourt fight it out for the starting SS and the other is utility. Add Counsel to that and we have bases covered.

Keppinger is a minus defender at short, albeit not as bad as Betancourt. Though they would both cost us runs defensively.

 

[sheetskout]

I want nothing to do with Punto.

 

My first choice would be Renteria

Agreed on Punto. I like his tools when healthy. And this guy has NEVER had over 500AB's in a season and hasn't had over 400 in three years.

[JohnBriggs12]

Since they're already paying Yuni, and his SLG, his only real positive, might well be helped by Miller Park, I wouldn't be in much of a hurry to make a move.

 

Betancourt's salary is a sunk cost, it should have zero effect on the decision to bring in another SS.

Melvin asked for Betancourt in the deal because he didn't want to scour the market. He's not going to go out and spend more on another one. Get used to it, Betancourt is the SS.

[TooLiveBrew]

Wanted to post this for tdeggie, who'd asked about more Fan Scouting Reports yesterday in the Betancourt thread. I used Nick Punto, along with the guys mentioned in the lead post of this thread, & those mentioned by southpaw in post #28. I added Cesar Izturis, who may be expendable for the O's now that they have Hardy. I only looked at 2010 data, but also included at the link above is fan balloting for 2002-'09

 

 Ovr. React./Inst. Accel. Spd. Hands Release/Ftwrk. Arm Str. Arm Acc. C. Izturis: 76 78 75 65 84 84 62 81 N. Punto: 70 78 77 69 79 75 48 66 E. Bonifacio: 62 54 81 84 47 51 62 57 M. Izturis: 60 64 67 60 67 61 44 55 J. Carroll: 56 62 56 56 56 59 35 65 J. Hairston: 53 54 58 58 46 56 51 49 J. Lowrie: 53 55 57 55 49 48 51 53 O. Cabrera: 50 55 36 37 63 63 43 56 M. Scutaro: 49 52 52 49 52 57 37 46 E. Renteria: 45 47 38 37 49 54 37 53 Betancourt: 34 19 15 30 27 32 68 46 Ryan: 78 87 85 75 83 76 73 66 Escobar: 72 70 82 83 57 72 78 62 Hardy: 68 75 64 47 70 75 75 66 Counsell: 60 67 52 49 68 74 43 68

 

Added Betancourt & some familiar faces (including Brendan Ryan) for comparison's sake. These ratings are on the 0-100 scale. Imo overall, it seems the fans' scouting leans toward the harsh side, with only the very elite players getting good scores. Take Ryan's overall score of 78 -- he's regarded as being as good as it gets with the glove at SS in MLB. And Escobar's arm, for another example... probably much, much closer to 90 in strength (Hardy nicknamed it "The Howitzer" in ST a while back), and easily over a 70 in accuracy imo. Hardy's arm should be graded much higher, as well. The fans are just tough critics, I guess.

 

I'd be happy to add to this chart if anyone had other guys they'd like to see compared.

[paulmolitor4]

I'd be happy to add to this chart if anyone had other guys they'd like to see compared.

It would be nice to see how Counsell compares to what's out there.