Packers Free Agency Thread

[BrewerFan]

5 hours ago, Sixtolezcano said:

I guess MLF and Gutey see something in selecting Jacobs over Jones that you don’t see.

They see all types of things I don't...when it comes to the draft or free agency.

That doesn't mean I have to like HOW they went about it.

[Sixtolezcano]

22 minutes ago, BrewerFan said:

They see all types of things I don't...when it comes to the draft or free agency.

That doesn't mean I have to like HOW they went about it.

Boy, you sure are argumentative. I never commented on your thoughts and feelings. You are more than welcomed to think whatever you like. I just said that their opinion differs from yours. Sorry I touched a nerve.

[MrTPlush]

On 3/16/2024 at 2:35 PM, LouisEly said:

It wasn't just games missed.  They had to limit his carries in most of the games that he played the first 13 weeks of the season last year.  Prior to week 14 he only had two games with 10 or more carries.  That also counts towards "injury history".

Yup, this seems to get glossed over a bit. Not only was he limited on carries in many games, but he also got injured midgame seemingly half the time he did end up playing. I am glad Aaron Jones went on a tear the last 5 games, but it also took him till the day before Christmas to manage 100 yards on the ground.

At his age depending on production or health is a bit to ask for...let alone at the same time. He is getting older, likely more fragile, and will see less and less carries even when healthy. Just the Packers trying to part ways on-time/too early versus when it is too late and suddenly we depend on AJ Dillon all year long. 

Hopefully it works out. They did what the entire fanbase would have done prior to Christmas. In the long run, we will come out ahead not basing the last month of production on what we are going to do in the offseason. 

[BrewerFan]

20 hours ago, Sixtolezcano said:

Boy, you sure are argumentative. I never commented on your thoughts and feelings. You are more than welcomed to think whatever you like. I just said that their opinion differs from yours. Sorry I touched a nerve.

I literally just agreed with you. I simply said I didn't like how they did it. 

[Sixtolezcano]

1 hour ago, BrewerFan said:

I literally just agreed with you. I simply said I didn't like how they did it. 

Sorry, I misinterpreted your post ☹️

[OldHeidelberg]

8 hours ago, MrTPlush said:

Yup, this seems to get glossed over a bit. Not only was he limited on carries in many games, but he also got injured midgame seemingly half the time he did end up playing. I am glad Aaron Jones went on a tear the last 5 games, but it also took him till the day before Christmas to manage 100 yards on the ground.

At his age depending on production or health is a bit to ask for...let alone at the same time. He is getting older, likely more fragile, and will see less and less carries even when healthy. Just the Packers trying to part ways on-time/too early versus when it is too late and suddenly we depend on AJ Dillon all year long. 

Hopefully it works out. They did what the entire fanbase would have done prior to Christmas. In the long run, we will come out ahead not basing the last month of production on what we are going to do in the offseason. 

I agree, like many of us I thought Jones was pretty close to done after the knee injury. I was a little annoyed they couldn't just offer him a little more and have a great duo but after thinking about it a few days that may have not even been on the table. Part of making the move to Jacobs was having a guy who can handle more carries, it really is more of a luxury than they could afford paying 2 starting RB's and neither the Packers nor Jones were likely interested at that point. It may blow up in their face but I think the odds are they made the right choice so I am just looking forward to seeing what Jacobs can do. Change is fun.

[HarveysWBs]

18 hours ago, OldHeidelberg said:

I agree, like many of us I thought Jones was pretty close to done after the knee injury. I was a little annoyed they couldn't just offer him a little more and have a great duo but after thinking about it a few days that may have not even been on the table. Part of making the move to Jacobs was having a guy who can handle more carries, it really is more of a luxury than they could afford paying 2 starting RB's and neither the Packers nor Jones were likely interested at that point. It may blow up in their face but I think the odds are they made the right choice so I am just looking forward to seeing what Jacobs can do. Change is fun.

This is kind of where I am, too, after rolling this around in my head for a while. We may never know the whole story, but if it was a question of Gutekunst (and LaFleur) being firm in their conviction that Jones isn’t really a RB#1 anymore because of his health availability but is probably the best “Robin” to somebody’s Batman in the NFL, and Jones just isn't ready to accept that—then I can come to terms with how this went down.

If, however, it was simply a question of Jones wanted one million more and would have been ok as the change of pace guy for Jacobs at a 7 mil rate, then Gutekunst just committed malpractice, because that’s the best backfield in football and that offense is a juggernaut next year. This seems so obvious that I have to think Jones just was not going to come back once Jacobs was signed, but I don’t know. Maybe the idea of having a year on turf was attractive for him, since his best performances are on the fast track.

As an aside, on the Green 19 pod (JS online), Spoon mentioned that Jones could have been a Leroy Butler, forever Packer type. He mentioned at one point that he could have “lived like a king” in Wisconsin as a fan favorite and done commercials for the rest of his life and transitioned into a emeritus position with the org after his playing days are over…and I actually laughed out loud. It is safe to say that most of us here love the Midwest in general and Wisconsin in particular, but the idea that a millionaire like Jones who could go live anywhere he wants would find being “king of Wisconsin” in his retirement is a huge draw amused me. He’s been a great guy for this org and the community, but it never occurred to me that he wanted to be a true lifer. And now we know that was never really likely.

[BrewerFan]

On 3/19/2024 at 11:12 AM, HarveysWBs said:

As an aside, on the Green 19 pod (JS online), Spoon mentioned that Jones could have been a Leroy Butler, forever Packer type. He mentioned at one point that he could have “lived like a king” in Wisconsin as a fan favorite and done commercials for the rest of his life and transitioned into a emeritus position with the org after his playing days are over…and I actually laughed out loud. It is safe to say that most of us here love the Midwest in general and Wisconsin in particular, but the idea that a millionaire like Jones who could go live anywhere he wants would find being “king of Wisconsin” in his retirement is a huge draw amused me. He’s been a great guy for this org and the community, but it never occurred to me that he wanted to be a true lifer. And now we know that was never really likely.

The "King of Wisconsin" thing is kinda corny...but Butler stayed. He's a millionaire.

Jones seemed like he wanted to. 

It's all moot now...but I really hate seeing the hate he's getting on Social Media like he's some trader. You cut a guy...he gets to sign with Minnesota or whomever.

Minny has a really good run-blocking OL, they play on Turf(which I think suits him well) and they don't have much at QB. So probably a good place for him to build up as much value as he can for next year. I'm also just not particularly worried about this Vikings team. 

[patrickgpe]

Packers sign Greg Joseph

I'm glad they signed a vet to compete with Carlson. Low cost, no risk move. I get developing a kicker, but that's a position that you can't wait 4 years for him to figure it out. My Issue is that Joseph actually made a lower % of FG's than Carlson last year.  He was better at Extra points though. 

[BrewerFan]

On 3/26/2024 at 12:03 PM, patrickgpe said:

Packers sign Greg Joseph

I'm glad they signed a vet to compete with Carlson. Low cost, no risk move. I get developing a kicker, but that's a position that you can't wait 4 years for him to figure it out. My Issue is that Joseph actually made a lower % of FG's than Carlson last year.  He was better at Extra points though. 

Yeah, he's also terrible from 50+ and kicked in a dome.

I think it's just to push Carlson. That's fine. I am confident he'll be just fine. He looked really good at times and then looked like he had the yips.

All in all, he was alright as a rookie and I don't think people would be too upset if not for the missed FG vs SF, but that was such a bad hold...not sure you can really blame him. Most kickers are missing that kick.

It's up to him. I like the signing. A good enough kicker, but Carlson is still in the drivers seat.

[Joseph Zarr]

I just wanted to say:

I am still in disbelief Mike Sherman traded UP in the 3rd Round to select BJ Sander. 

Carry on...

[yourout]

11 hours ago, Joseph Zarr said:

I just wanted to say:

I am still in disbelief Mike Sherman traded UP in the 3rd Round to select BJ Sander. 

Carry on...

Top 3 worst draft picks in packer history.

[Joseph Zarr]

1 hour ago, yourout said:

Top 3 worst draft picks in packer history.

As I typically do, I was in the midst of an elaborate man cave Draft experience. I had made a fresh batch of pulled pork man nachos. Had just finished my batch of guacamole. Was finalizing the top dressing the cacophony of corn ships and accoutrement. Then, from the basement, my good friend yells up: "They traded up! The Packers are on the clock!" In a fit of excitement, clearly unbefitting what was to occur, I sped up. I grabbed the massive tray of man nachos and ran toward the stairs. AND, I kid you not, I tripped. And, I kid you not, the nachos went flying. Down the stairs. Smashed into the back door after a couple bounces - we had one of those 3/4 in ground basements with a back door going out to a yard and down to a small lake. Just food trash everywhere. Broken pyrex baking dish everywhere. The Packers select BJ Sander, Punter, Ohio State. 

Definitively my worst Packers draft moment ever. Just an awful awful series of events.

[Matt Breen]

16 hours ago, Joseph Zarr said:

I just wanted to say:

I am still in disbelief Mike Sherman traded UP in the 3rd Round to select BJ Sander. 

Carry on...

I sometimes think we all believe we are the smartest person in the room. We get it into our heads that we know better than everyone. And to prove that - we have to make declarations or make decisions that go counter to the collective thought. 

You just wonder about the logic that brought them to this decision. 

 

[patrickgpe]

17 hours ago, Joseph Zarr said:

I just wanted to say:

I am still in disbelief Mike Sherman traded UP in the 3rd Round to select BJ Sander. 

Carry on...

its why you don't make the coach the GM as well. He wanted said punter for his team so he did what he had to do to make sure he got him. Any decent GM would have been more practical. checks and balances exist for a reason. 

[BrewerFan]

35 minutes ago, patrickgpe said:

its why you don't make the coach the GM as well. He wanted said punter for his team so he did what he had to do to make sure he got him. Any decent GM would have been more practical. checks and balances exist for a reason. 

Yeah...that may be about as extreme an example as you get. At least when Bellichick did it, it was Cole Strange, an guard that nobody thought would go until maybe late rd 3 and he takes him in the first.

Another good reason...you hear MLF claiming he had no knowledge of the Aaron Jones situation or just after the whole Jordan Love selection? I do not believe either one happens without him signing off. In fact, I seem to remember reports that HE was the one that really liked Love among the two...but MLF could look at Rodgers and say, 'of course I want you as my QB...those decisions, they're above my head.'

It's just a smarter way to do things. How often does it work out? Belichick needed Brady. Holmgren did alright for a while. Jimmy Johnson? It's an outlier when it works.

 

[homer]

4 hours ago, reillymcshane said:

I sometimes think we all believe we are the smartest person in the room. We get it into our heads that we know better than everyone. And to prove that - we have to make declarations or make decisions that go counter to the collective thought. 

You just wonder about the logic that brought them to this decision. 

 

Timely post given the recent passing of Daniel Kahneman

[LouisEly]

7 hours ago, reillymcshane said:

I sometimes think we all believe we are the smartest person in the room. We get it into our heads that we know better than everyone. And to prove that - we have to make declarations or make decisions that go counter to the collective thought. 

You just wonder about the logic that brought them to this decision. 

 

IIRC the reasoning stated by Sherman at the time was that Sander "had experience punting in big games".

[Matt Breen]

2 hours ago, LouisEly said:

IIRC the reasoning stated by Sherman at the time was that Sander "had experience punting in big games".

That's awesome. Just awesome. Too bad those games weren't it crappy winter conditions.

[JosephC]

I whined and complained about that trade up to get Sander.  But I will say, Sander may have had the greatest game by a punter I ever saw.  It was an Ohio State-Purdue game, and Sander must have had 5 punts in that game that put Purdue within their own 5 yard line.  That had to have happened over 20 years ago and I still remember it.

But Sander did not have a big leg.  I would had no problem with the Packers taking him in the fifth based on his directional ability, and if that would have happened, I would defend the pick as reasonable at the time it was made (even though Sander was a bust).  But to trade up into round three was near insanity.

My favorite Sherman draft story was when he took Javon Walker, and in the press conference at the end of the day he literally said, "he has trouble catching the ball, but he has 10 1/2 inch hands so we'll teach him to catch the ball."  I am probably not remembering the exact hand measurement, but the rest of that quote is really close to what he said. 

Back to specialists...even the best get burned by that every now and then.  Even though Wolf didn't do a very good job in round one IMO, he was absolutely remarkable in the later rounds and overall was a true master when handling the draft.  But he took Penn State kicker Brett Conway in the third round, and that guy was awful.  If memory serves me correctly, he missed three field goals in the first pre-season game and everyone in the state knew at that moment that he would amount to nothing.

[BrewerFan]

2 hours ago, JosephC said:

My favorite Sherman draft story was when he took Javon Walker, and in the press conference at the end of the day he literally said, "he has trouble catching the ball, but he has 10 1/2 inch hands so we'll teach him to catch the ball."  I am probably not remembering the exact hand measurement, but the rest of that quote is really close to what he said. 

Back to specialists...even the best get burned by that every now and then.  Even though Wolf didn't do a very good job in round one IMO, he was absolutely remarkable in the later rounds and overall was a true master when handling the draft.

Wolf and Thompson just seemed to try and stock up with as many late-round picks as possible to just throw darts and hope they hit. You get a Driver in the 7th, Tauscher, guys like that make your draft. Day3 is where both really thrived. 

Gute did as well, but has placed more of a premium on the athletic profile. Not sure any team(maybe NOLA) has higher average RAS scores. Thompsons were much lower, he wasn't nearly as aggressive, but man, up until 2016, he also had success with Day 3 picks.

Sherman went for the more athletic profiles, but seems like he didn't do the scouting part nearly as much. That same year they took Sander, they took a big DT from Clemson a few picks earlier. A guy who got hurt, then showed up so out of weight that he was sent home and cut.

It's too early to compare Gute, but he's off to one helluva start. Utilizes Free Agency, he's aggressive in the draft, but also stocks up on those picks. Walked a real fine line trying to win while also focusing on the future. Excited to see what he does in this draft. 

Just a side note, last time we were picking 41(I think)...The Packers traded two mid-early 3rd Rd picks for the 26th pick and a 6th for CMIII. Maybe DeJean and Cooper are both on the board and history repeats itself? Probably not. 

[CheezWizHed]

19 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

Wolf and Thompson just seemed to try and stock up with as many late-round picks as possible to just throw darts and hope they hit. You get a Driver in the 7th, Tauscher, guys like that make your draft. Day3 is where both really thrived. 

Gute did as well, but has placed more of a premium on the athletic profile. Not sure any team(maybe NOLA) has higher average RAS scores. Thompsons were much lower, he wasn't nearly as aggressive, but man, up until 2016, he also had success with Day 3 picks.

Sherman went for the more athletic profiles, but seems like he didn't do the scouting part nearly as much. That same year they took Sander, they took a big DT from Clemson a few picks earlier. A guy who got hurt, then showed up so out of weight that he was sent home and cut.

It's too early to compare Gute, but he's off to one helluva start. Utilizes Free Agency, he's aggressive in the draft, but also stocks up on those picks. Walked a real fine line trying to win while also focusing on the future. Excited to see what he does in this draft. 

Just a side note, last time we were picking 41(I think)...The Packers traded two mid-early 3rd Rd picks for the 26th pick and a 6th for CMIII. Maybe DeJean and Cooper are both on the board and history repeats itself? Probably not. 

I do really sense that we will using those 5 picks in the top 3 rounds to move up.  Having 11 picks this year after 13 last year just makes it feel likely.  Not sure if we move up higher in the first round or move up to get 2 in the first round... but just feels like one of them is likely.

[BrewerFan]

2 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

I do really sense that we will using those 5 picks in the top 3 rounds to move up.  Having 11 picks this year after 13 last year just makes it feel likely.  Not sure if we move up higher in the first round or move up to get 2 in the first round... but just feels like one of them is likely.

I'd tend to agree. They need quality more than quantity and they have two really big holes to fill...IOL, LB. 

Secondary is a need. I'd say it's fine if Barry was still here, but if you're going to play a much higher pct of single high-man coverage.

I know my preference would be to trade up for a guy like Fautanu(especially given the combine which really cements him as an OT prospect who can at worst start at OG). I'd guess that be who they'd be targeting between the Seahawks picks...if that rumor is true(seems unlikely they'd be that invested this early) OR another CB. DeJean fits the bill at both if he tests well, so he could be move up the board, Mitchell has been outstanding in the pre-draft process. 

And they need to get an LB and probably before #50 or so. 

They could get that RG later and worry about OT later, but the OT classes have been terrible for the last several years. This year it's loaded. Plus, again, Fautanu would likely be a Tyler Smith-type OL, but more polished and NFL-ready coming out.