2023-24 Bucks Season Thread

[sveumrules]

35 minutes ago, nate82 said:

Crowder out 8 weeks.  
https://www.fox6now.com/sports/bucks-jae-crowder-to-undergo-surgery.amp

Ouch.

Hopefully means more minutes for Andre Jackson Jr,

[nate82]

1 hour ago, sveumrules said:

Ouch.

Hopefully means more minutes for Andre Jackson Jr,

Probably means they will have to ramp up Middleton’s minutes earlier than expected and increase everyone else’s minutes.

[areacodes]

I’ll say this with the caveat that I’m not sold on Griffin as the coach nor was I 100% on board with firing Bud but I think people are overreacting a bit to the record early on this year.

Yes, the Bucks got off to a fast start a few times under Bud but also had some pretty meh starts too.

‘20-‘21: 6-4
’21-‘22: 4-6 (wasn’t above .500 until winning game #17)

I was always expecting it to take some time to gel with adding Dame and Giannis/Khris recovering from surgery in the offseason all with a new coach.

If we are healthy and hovering around .500 when the calendar turns to 2024, I’d be much more concerned.

[homer]

I like this quote from AJJ:

“I think I can make an impact without scoring the basketball,” Jackson said. “Just screening, being in the spot to create the space for the guys that need the ball. On this team, if I’m on the court, I’m most likely, probably, the fifth option in scoring, so I’m just going to try to do everything in my power to get those other guys clean looks and follow up their misses if they do miss and try to find another guy.”

[CheezWizHed]

17 hours ago, areacodes said:

I’ll say this with the caveat that I’m not sold on Griffin as the coach nor was I 100% on board with firing Bud but I think people are overreacting a bit to the record early on this year.

Yes, the Bucks got off to a fast start a few times under Bud but also had some pretty meh starts too.

‘20-‘21: 6-4
’21-‘22: 4-6 (wasn’t above .500 until winning game #17)

I was always expecting it to take some time to gel with adding Dame and Giannis/Khris recovering from surgery in the offseason all with a new coach.

If we are healthy and hovering around .500 when the calendar turns to 2024, I’d be much more concerned.

Yeah, I'm patient to wait and see how the team gels, but the really, really poor defensive approach by the team from a defensive minded coach is a red flag.  I didn't expect the team to be top 5 defense, but in the 20s?  

Dame's shooting is oddly horrible too, so there is probably much to gain when he ramps back up. 

Would be nice to see them fill Stott's spot too.  All being said (new rookie coach, new offensive coach, Giannis+Dame figuring each other out)... It will easily be into the 2nd half of the year before we could see this team stabilize.

[sveumrules]

26 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

Dame's shooting is oddly horrible too, so there is probably much to gain when he ramps back up. 

Lillard has historically been a slow starter.

.571 TS% career in November vs .588, .595, .595 and .589 career marks in December through March.

Was even more pronounced last season with a .533 TS% in November followed by .635, .670, .688 and .614 marks for December through March.

[nate82]

Dame doing Dame things tonight.

[nate82]

So far tonight Dame has shot 16 FT's and the Raptors as a team have shot 21. 

[sveumrules]

Bucks starting to come together a little bit with a nice four game winning streak that included a revenge game at Toronto, an In Season Tournament win over the Hornets and then taking down Dallas last night on the B2B.

After winning their first five games by 15 combined points with four losses sprinkled in, they have won the last four in the streak by 63 combined.

Giannis looks to be rounding into shape nicely after an offseason with little basketball activity...

First Seven Games
24.4 PPG | 9.0 RPG | 3.4 APG | .525 FG%

Last Six Games (missed one)
36.0 PPG | 11.2 RPG | 5.6 APG | .676 FG%

Dame has also put together his best run of the season over the last three games, hopefully a sign of things to come...

First Eleven Games (missed two)
22.8 PPG | 4.8 APG | .370 FG% | .269 3P%

Last Three Games
30.3 PPG | 10.0 APG | .463 FG% | .419 3P%

On the season as a whole, despite the slow start, the offense has been humming (6th in ORtg). Have to imagine as familiarity grows between Giannis/Dame and Khris starts getting more minutes that they should easily finish inside the Top 5.

Next steps for Griffin and staff need to be figuring out rebounding (currently 26th) and defense (currently 22nd).
 

[patrickgpe]

Big test of the bucks tonight, 2 best teams in the east’s first matchup. Will see where the bucks are. Both teams completed changed their identity right before training camp, so i get both teams are learning how to play together. would be nice to get a W though. 

[wildcat83]

First game of the year that I’ve watched, Bucks offense has no ball movement.  About 85% of the possessions so far are iso, just expecting guys to go score 1 on 1.

[SomewhereInTime]

Gonna be a real battle to avoid the play in game this year.

[patrickgpe]

2 hours ago, wildcat83 said:

First game of the year that I’ve watched, Bucks offense has no ball movement.  About 85% of the possessions so far are iso, just expecting guys to go score 1 on 1.

Give it time, they switched point guards right before camp and have a rookie coach 

[young guns]

Great game tonight and I'm still on the fence about this in season tournament, but we did win our group and clinch the 1 seed in the east.

[BrewerFan]

On 11/22/2023 at 7:34 PM, SomewhereInTime said:

Gonna be a real battle to avoid the play in game this year.

And...with those "struggles," we're a game out of the #1 seed. 

Gonna be a battle to avoid being that play-in team!

 

[CheezWizHed]

Wow does our defense still need a lot of work... but wow with a healthy Khris out there did our offense pose a challenge.  Nothing like defenses trying to shut down Dame AND Khris and have GA waiting to cut in for a lob or pass while breaking to the hoop.

At the end of the 4th, Miami's formidable D looked helpless when they are covering Dame 30 feet from the basket, trying to stop Khris in 1on1 20 feet from the basket while trying to keep Giannis from cutting to the hoop for an easy dunk. You have 3 levels of daggers going on all at once. 

[GAME05]

Giannis moving without the ball so much better lately and actually trying to get involved with some pick and rolls, too. 

Heck, our offense still has as much room to grow as our defense does. By the end of the season our offense could get downright ridiculous.

[BrewerFan]

2 hours ago, GAME05 said:

Giannis moving without the ball so much better lately and actually trying to get involved with some pick and rolls, too. 

Heck, our offense still has as much room to grow as our defense does. By the end of the season our offense could get downright ridiculous.

I'm pretty impressed with Dame's level of effort on defense. Nobody will ever confuse him with Jrue, but he's getting deflections, he's playing hard in the post, caused a travel last night, drew a charge. 

The defensive issues just seem like a communication thing. Clearly we struggle stopping penetration, but with Giannis and Lopez, it should be better. I am seeing some pretty good stretches of play, but not putting it together.

Losing Crowder hurts. I like the intensity on this team though.

[wallus]

The defense scheme and plan are a mess. It doesn't help when you have guards that can't stay in front of their man.

[BrewerFan]

10 minutes ago, wallus said:

The defense scheme and plan are a mess. It doesn't help when you have guards that can't stay in front of their man.

I don't think the scheme is a mess. I think it's a different style of play that relies on more backside help on penetration. I think we all understood that losing Jrue was going to be a MASSIVE loss on that side of the ball, but I think they're figuring it out and adjusting. 

It's definitely a team that even with Crowder, will have some holes...as opposed to the Celtics who, provided they stay healthy, should have a more well-rounded team. But come playoff time as more physical play is allowed and these guys have had another 4 months together, I don't think we're going to be a terrible defensive team.

I do hope all the people who complained about Jrue now appreciate what a stud he was for us. I also hope that as the season passes, Marjon and AJJ can develop a bit more, Crowder comes back at full strength. I don't know if there's a trade the Bucks can still make to add a really good defensive guard.  

I see Caruso, Dort thrown out there. Who are we trading? Portis I guess? That could work with a healthy Crowder, but you'd have to likely add Marjon.

Royce O'neal is another one. As I understand it, you can no longer add salaries to make trades if you're over the 2nd apron, and you can't take more money back(even the 120%+100K or whatever it is exactly). So again, Portis. 

I saw one proposal to get Caruso and it was a tough pill to swallow. It was Portis, Connaughton, Beauchamp+2 2nds for Alex Caruso and Kenrich Williams.

 

That seems like a TON to give up, but to play devil's advocate, Williams can help cover Portis minutes. He may even thrive as he's a competent 3-point shooter, a solid defender. 28 years old, so not a future star. Caruso is nearly 30, but a really underrated player. 

It's an unrealistic trade, and while I think Beasley has generally been pretty good for the Bucks...this video alone makes you think, "yeah, maybe we do need to make a move!"

 

 

[RedStickBrew]

Strong effort from the Bucks in the in season tournament thus far. On to Vegas and the final four. I think they will still need to do something to shore up the D though this year

[CheezWizHed]

Honestly, the D looked better today.  Not Top 5, but they will never be "that" team.  But not that many open shots/drives as previous games I've seen.  Good hands, forcing turnovers.  Not great on the defensive boards tonight though.  The Knicks were hot and hitting everything... to some degree the best D won't stop that. Not in modern NBA ball anyway. 

With their offense, they just need to avoid the wide open buckets or layups; make teams fight and earn the score.  Their offense is going to wear people out eventually. 

[Outlander]

First time going to a Bucks game in over a year, this tournament was a nice opportunity to get upper level middle tickets for less than $10 a piece. Fun game with pretty much no defense, the Bucks would hit a three and immediately give up a layup.  They also throw stuff in the crowd after a made three and that was getting pretty annoying.

Maybe one of the best things about this tournament is pretty much guarantee the name players will play instead of load management. Could buy these tickets for my kids and know they will see Giannis and Lillard, which is important driving from the Madison area.

[BrewerFan]

18 hours ago, CheezWizHed said:

Honestly, the D looked better today.  Not Top 5, but they will never be "that" team.  But not that many open shots/drives as previous games I've seen.  Good hands, forcing turnovers.  Not great on the defensive boards tonight though.  The Knicks were hot and hitting everything... to some degree the best D won't stop that. Not in modern NBA ball anyway. 

With their offense, they just need to avoid the wide open buckets or layups; make teams fight and earn the score.  Their offense is going to wear people out eventually. 

I've been impressed with Dame. He's never going to be Jrue(or even an average defender). But he's playing with effort, he's taking charges...which I'm not sure I'm a huge fan of at this point in the season, but he's also getting deflections, steals.

When he starts shooting closer to his norms, you're not gonna need him to be Gary Payton on that side. You ARE going to need the team to be more cohesive, but they've been moving in that direction. 

19 hours ago, RedStickBrew said:

Strong effort from the Bucks in the in season tournament thus far. On to Vegas and the final four. I think they will still need to do something to shore up the D though this year

I am having trouble seeing how they upgrade that defense given the Draconian rules regarding teams above the 2nd apron. 

I think it'd probably have to be a bigger trade and it'd involve Portis...which would be a slap in the face, but we are trying to win a Title. 

The trade rumor I've heard was Portis, Connaughton, Marjon and 2 2nds for Caruso and Kenrich Williams in a 3-team trade.

Now you'd likely have Dame/Caruso/Middleton/Giannis/Lopez and then when Crowder is healthy a 2nd team of
Payne/Jackson Jr/Williams/Crowder/R Lopez?

I don't know if that's worth it or not, but you could improve your Defense quite a bit. That was just a made-up trade, but it feels about right. There'd be a tax to trade with the Bulls presumably and get an all-NBA perimeter defender. You'd be giving up on Beauchamp.  I don't know if that makes you better or not. Portis isn't a great defender, but he's a high-energy player(and one who's taken a whole lot less to play in Milwaukee). 

Even that trade though, my understanding is you can't add multiple players in a trade when over that 2nd apron. So I don't even know if that trade would be legal. 

[young guns]

Not a great first half against the pacers, especially Dame.  Good to see him hitting the 3 out of halftime though