What to do with Wiemer

[Playing Catch]

He's dynamic! He's polarizing! In AAA he's Eric Davis. In MLB he's... Joey Wiemer.

In the months since he was last seen playing for the big club, I've forgiven and forgotten all of those Wiemer whiffs, and have somehow fallen in love with him all over again.

His introduction to the big leagues was premature. Will this stunt his growth? Or will that crucible crack open all of that prospect promise?

If he's a player that the team believes has value and a future as a big league hitter (we all know he's a big league defender), do you sell low on him? Do you hope that with some humility and maturity he will polish his game in Nashville? Or do you put him right back on the horse to start the season, and have him be part of an outfield mix?

If they don't believe he'll ever be anything special, I suppose they can just bury him on the depth chart with his minor league options, and we fans will just have to wistfully daydream about what could have been... Ah! what to have a golden-haired, mustachioed Icarus flying around centerfield and feasting on center-cut fastballs, sending them into the leftfield bleachers! Bah! What could have been... what should have been.

[Ro Mueller]

To me, Wiemer’s a potential 30HR / 30SB / 170K guy with a terrific arm for right field.

The challenge is that it may take him 2-3 years for his bat to come around at the MLB level.

I’d earlier estimated that we’ll option him to AAA for about 74 days in 2024 for service time manipulation…er…to let him work on improving his overall hitting.

But if we can get another insane Ruiz-for-Contreras type deal, we’ll have to take it.

[jay87shot]

I would hate to trade him when his value is low, however he would seem the easiest to move/lose. If I were to trade him it would be for a big upside pitcher/3rd who is young controllable and probably didn't have a great 2023. Miguel Vargas and Gavin Stone from the Dodgers fit the mold, maybe Jose Miranda other other Twins package, Oswald Peraza could be the starting a deal as well.

In a perfect world, we could trade Yelich and get a solid young contributor and let Weimer, Frelick, Mitchell, and Taylor all play and then sort it out come say June/July when Chourio can no longer be contained in AAA.

[jay87shot]

23 minutes ago, damuelle said:

To me, Wiemer’s a potential 30HR / 30SB / 170K guy with a terrific arm for right field.

The challenge is that it may take him 2-3 years for his bat to come around at the MLB level.

I’d earlier estimated that we’ll option him to AAA for about 74 days in 2024 for service time manipulation…er…to let him work on improving his overall hitting.

But if we can get another insane Ruiz-for-Contreras type deal, we’ll have to take it.

I agree but he only struck out 116 time last year so if he meets his potential and hits  270/350/900 he shouldn't have crazy K numbers. He just needs to lay off breaking pitches out of the zone and not pop up as many pitches as hit did last year.

[wildcat2237]

1 hour ago, damuelle said:

To me, Wiemer’s a potential 30HR / 30SB / 170K guy with a terrific arm for right field.

The challenge is that it may take him 2-3 years for his bat to come around at the MLB level.

I’d earlier estimated that we’ll option him to AAA for about 74 days in 2024 for service time manipulation…er…to let him work on improving his overall hitting.

But if we can get another insane Ruiz-for-Contreras type deal, we’ll have to take it.

I think this is spot on. He heads to AAA to start the first two months of the season. If things go well, he gets a callup mid-season. If not, I think he could languish a bit or be traded. 

[edfunderburk]

47 minutes ago, jay87shot said:

In a perfect world, we could trade Yelich and get a solid young contributor and let Weimer, Frelick, Mitchell, and Taylor all play and then sort it out come say June/July when Chourio can no longer be contained in AAA.

My sentiments exactly - trading Yelich now … although unpopular in this forum

I’m also in favor of trading Burnes during the offseason - hoping the return brings young talent for our World Series run in 2025

[Austin Tatious]

Wiemer is an enigma to me.  To be fair, though, IMO he needed all of ‘23 at Nashville but was pressed into MLB action.  Absolutely love his power/speed/defense (range and arm) combination.  But I absolutely hate his approach at the plate.  Wild and erratic.  If that can get reined in, he can be a quality player.  That’s an unknown though.  Out of Mitchell, Chourio, Frelick, I’d put Wiemer behind them on our priority list.  

[jay87shot]

If we could develop everyone fully Frelick is a .300 hitting leadoff man with a gold glove in left, Chourio hits upper .275-.300 with 30/30 or better with high end defense and Weimer or Mitchell hit over .250 with 30/30 potential and gold glove in RF. If we could only develop hitter in the bigs.

[brewmann04]

They have to work on his hitting 

[Fear The Chorizo]

He didn't have one of his options burned last season, so it makes a ton of sense to start wiemer in AAA this season and have him there the full year as injury insurance.

 

If he develops as a hitter, he's a guy you can build around...but he's got to have a quieter approach and swing to reach that potential at the MLB level.

[wiguy94]

33 minutes ago, Fear The Chorizo said:

He didn't have one of his options burned last season, so it makes a ton of sense to start wiemer in AAA this season and have him there the full year as injury insurance.

Are you 100% sure of that? Fangraphs has him with 2 options remaining to start 2024.

[Ro Mueller]

54 minutes ago, wiguy94 said:

Are you 100% sure of that? Fangraphs has him with 2 options remaining to start 2024.

They also have James Meeker as a LHP. 😁

Wiemer appears to have been optioned for only 15 days (Sep 17 - Oct 2), so I also believe he has 3 options left, unless there’s more to the rule.

[Lathund]

There's no rush to do anything with Wiemer or any of the other young OFs. They all have options, they're all cheap, they all play multiple OF positions, and there *will* be injuries. I'd suggest just waiting to see who looks like the real deal and who doesn't. 

That is unless they already feel like they have an idea of who might not be able to make it, or at least is the least likely to make it. With the access to the surface level stats we as fans have, that's probably Wiemer. However he probably also has a higher ceiling, in that *if* he ever hits enough to get to that stupid raw power he's a star. 

I'd generally suggest that unless some slam dunk type of trade like the Contreras trade shows up, then just let him work on his game in AAA and see what you have. I just don't see how that swing can have ML success; not that completely revamping everything that got him here is realistic, but there's just so much extra movement and so many moving parts that I don't see how it can ever be consistent so it needs at least some refinement.

[BrewerFan]

18 minutes ago, Lathund said:

There's no rush to do anything with Wiemer or any of the other young OFs. They all have options, they're all cheap, they all play multiple OF positions, and there *will* be injuries. I'd suggest just waiting to see who looks like the real deal and who doesn't. 

That is unless they already feel like they have an idea of who might not be able to make it, or at least is the least likely to make it. With the access to the surface level stats we as fans have, that's probably Wiemer. However he probably also has a higher ceiling, in that *if* he ever hits enough to get to that stupid raw power he's a star. 

I'd generally suggest that unless some slam dunk type of trade like the Contreras trade shows up, then just let him work on his game in AAA and see what you have. I just don't see how that swing can have ML success; not that completely revamping everything that got him here is realistic, but there's just so much extra movement and so many moving parts that I don't see how it can ever be consistent. 

This is the only answer. There's no rush to do anything other than give Chourio a 10 year extension, but since this isn't about him, just let 'em all play.

I thought Taylor had no chance to be an MLB regular and he's been a pretty damn nice player for us, especially later in the year last year. He's had some rough starts and what not, but Wiemer should at LEAST be a guy who plays elite defense, hits for a lot of power and maybe he struggles to hit .225 and maintain an OBP over .300. That's still not a terrible case scenario for a guy who'll again, likely hit for power and could probably win a GG in RF and possibly in CF. 

[MNBrew]

On 11/23/2023 at 12:56 AM, damuelle said:

They also have James Meeker as a LHP. 😁

Wiemer appears to have been optioned for only 15 days (Sep 17 - Oct 2), so I also believe he has 3 options left, unless there’s more to the rule.

He was optioned, so that's an option.  Because he didn't stay down for 20 days, he doesn't lose any MLB service time between when he went down & came back up.

[Ro Mueller]

6 hours ago, MNBrew said:

He was optioned, so that's an option.  Because he didn't stay down for 20 days, he doesn't lose any MLB service time between when he went down & came back up.

Thanks, but I'm not convinced he's burned an option yet. MLB website says, "Once an optioned player has spent at least 20 days in the Minors in a given season, he loses one of his options."

[SRB]

I must be in the minority, but I thought Wiemer had a very encouraging debut season and I would pencil him in as our regular CF. I'm even more optimistic about him than Frelick or Mitchell.

Yeah he was inconsistent and had some rough patches on offense, but he showed elite defense and enough hot streaks to make me believe in the offensive upside. What more do you want in a rookie season for a 24-year-old who was rushed pretty quickly to the majors (<200 PA at AAA)

To me his value is higher after holding his own in the majors than when he was purely a top-100 prospect.

[brewcrewdue80]

To me there's too much upside to trade him. You would need too much upside player value in return at a different position to make a trade worthwhile. Defense is special, I'd rate above Frelick for sure. Wiemer has the power potential for outside CF play, Frelick not so much. Mitchell is the combo between the two that I think fits CF defense the best....but coming off his injury will it remain.  That's a dynamic that will need time figuring out.

What's keeping Wiemer's style from not becoming the type of Joc Pederson with plus defense though?  That's a 116OPS+ from RH side clamoring for 30HRs.  It'd probably just be because the trio of Chourio-Mitchell-Frelick are better and there's no room to play him consistently. 

[Brewcrew82]

You have to make contact to get to your raw power. While I'm hopeful he can make the necessary adjustments, particularly mechanically, it's far from a guarantee. And I don't know if he's more likely to successfully make them than our other guys.

[Underachiever]

On 11/26/2023 at 12:38 PM, SRB said:

I must be in the minority, but I thought Wiemer had a very encouraging debut season and I would pencil him in as our regular CF. I'm even more optimistic about him than Frelick or Mitchell.

Yeah he was inconsistent and had some rough patches on offense, but he showed elite defense and enough hot streaks to make me believe in the offensive upside. What more do you want in a rookie season for a 24-year-old who was rushed pretty quickly to the majors (<200 PA at AAA)

To me his value is higher after holding his own in the majors than when he was purely a top-100 prospect.

I am also in the Wiemer camp. I feel like people really got down on him and said things such as "that bat will never play." It seemed out of proportion for a guy who was in his first 100 or so games as a major leaguer. 

Now, where I also feel out of step is that I don't see why everyone is so high on Garrett Mitchell. I am willing to be convinced. But any argument has to somehow assure me first that his injury problems are behind him. 

[brewers888]

I don't know how anyone can watch the awful swing mechanics of Wiemer and think he will ever hit enough to be useful. The defense is great but I just do not see him ever becoming a decent much less good hitter. While I wouldn't give him away I would happily trade Wiemer if the Brewers can get a good return especially if that is young pitching.

[BrewerFan]

2 hours ago, Underachiever said:

I am also in the Wiemer camp. I feel like people really got down on him and said things such as "that bat will never play." It seemed out of proportion for a guy who was in his first 100 or so games as a major leaguer. 

Now, where I also feel out of step is that I don't see why everyone is so high on Garrett Mitchell. I am willing to be convinced. But any argument has to somehow assure me first that his injury problems are behind him. 

I'm right there with you. It kinda feels like with Mitchell is maybe a bit overrated because he's had some big moments with the Brewers and his final line from his rookie year looked good(after a 3-hit game raised his OPS ~200 points). 

I like him, I'm not down on him and I can swayed as well(hell, I can be swayed on any player on any of my teams) if he performs. It's just the Ground Balls+the Ks to me don't suggest the same high offensive profile. Then you have the injuries...he's the #4 OF prospect for me(among the MLB-ready guys). 

42 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

I don't know how anyone can watch the awful swing mechanics of Wiemer and think he will ever hit enough to be useful. The defense is great but I just do not see him ever becoming a decent much less good hitter. While I wouldn't give him away I would happily trade Wiemer if the Brewers can get a good return especially if that is young pitching.

Likely because we've seen him excel in the minors AND have hot stretches in the big leagues.

Go listen to Tony Gwynn's comments about your stance or bat movement.

I'll summarize. It's meaningless. It's all about where you are when the ball is released. If you're loaded and in a position to swing at that point. The rest is pointless. 

 

Maybe all of that stuff will help him identify the pitches better or maybe this is just his swing and he'll come around and he's being judged too harshly given he should have started last year and spent at least a couple of months in AAA, but was pressed into duty. But I don't pretend to be an expert on the mechanics of hitting. When I played travel ball, we all had the same swing...except the guy who was actually good enough to play in College and his was an open stance with his hands low.