Packers 2024 Off-Season Thread

[patrickgpe]

4 minutes ago, areacodes said:

I didn’t take it as you were bashing him.

I was genuinely curious as to why you’d prefer a coach with no coordinator experience just because he coached at the pro level.

I think it’s different coaching a 20 year old “amateur” vs a 30 year old multi million dollar pro. Maybe his time in the pros prepared him for that. I just saw too many successful college coaches try pro and fail. 
and yes many pro coaches started in college. They also worked their way up as a positional coach, not a defensive coordinator out of the shoot 

[BrewerFan]

4 hours ago, GAME05 said:

Packers have made enough mistakes not drafting Badgers players, starting with Troy Vincent. I'd like to not do the same with former Badger coaches. If he even wants the job, anyway.

Yeah, there are Badgers we should have taken. Vincent turned out to be one(though T-Buck was a really good CB, we just gave up on him early IMO). I remember doing a poll at the time of the TJ Watt draft. About 70%(IIRC, but it was well over 50) was happy with the trading down and getting King+Biegel rather than TJ. Obviously another huge blunder.

But what annoys me...is this "if he weren't a Badger," crap. We're probably being a bit harsh toward @patrickgpe. But I've been hearing it constantly. "We wouldn't even think of him if he wasn't the Badgers coach." 

Nonsense. He's a great young defensive mind. There have been 2 Badgers I've wanted badly that have been realistic. Chenal and Leonhard. 

I think if anything, we're a little harder on Badgers on here. Or maybe it's just me, but I didn't think Herbig was a quality NFL edge, I didn't think Frederick would be a borderline HOF caliber Center(I didn't even think he'd be a good one). I wasn't a fan of Biadaz, I don't want to see Braelon Allen taken in the first 3 rounds by the Packers. This isn't a homer thing, seeing it through rose-colored glasses, the guy just comes up with blitz packages that not many other coaches run. And sure, it got him burned at times vs OSU and their 4 1st rd WRers or whoever. But it also helped the Badgers compete and beat some Michigan teams or compete with PSU, ND a couple years ago until Mertz melted down and threw them 21 points late in the game.

 

If we end up with Wink, I'll be happy as he's a very accomplished coach. If it's Jesse Minter...I'll be a little more skeptical, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. If it's Leonhard, I KNOW we'll have a good DC who's going to have his corners up protecting the sticks on 3rd down, who'll have 6 guys in the box on the LOS(and if not, there's a good chance a corner or someone else is coming) and we'll make them earn the 1st down, it won't just be TJ Hockenson running a 7-yard curl on 3rd and 5.

 

 

[BrewerFan]

1 hour ago, patrickgpe said:

@BrewerFan @areacodes @LouisEly I did say that if MLF thought he was the best candidate, I wouldn’t be upset. I do wish that they brought in someone with pro coaching experience since he would be running the d with an offensive focused coach. I never said he was a bad coach, ran a poor scheme or anything. He always struck me as a smart coach. Jeez, I wasn’t bashing him at all, just stating my opinion on the profile of the coach I wanted them to hire 

 

1 hour ago, areacodes said:

I didn’t take it as you were bashing him.

I was genuinely curious as to why you’d prefer a coach with no coordinator experience just because he coached at the pro level.

 

No, I didn't take it as bashing him. Again, it's probably the overwhelming, "if Leonhard wasn't a Badger...." comments in total, not just here.

[patrickgpe]

6 hours ago, BrewerFan said:

 

 

No, I didn't take it as bashing him. Again, it's probably the overwhelming, "if Leonhard wasn't a Badger...." comments in total, not just here.

I get that. I do think many Packer fans want Leonard because they watch the badgers each week and liked his defense. If he was the d coordinator for say Alabama or USC whom most packer fans don’t watch maybe each and every week, wouldn’t be so high on him. So maybe not because he is a badger but familiar and comfortable with what he can do. 

[Underachiever]

I think the thing I don't understand is that LaFleur isn't going to hire Leonhard because he is from Wisconsin, so this is really a non-issue. We aren't taking fan voting for the next Packer DC. Patrick said it himself. "If LaFleur thought he was the best candidate, I wouldn't be upset." Well, why else would he hire him? 

I can want Jim Leonhard to be DC (and I do) and it definitely has something to do with watching his defenses get after it. It also has something to do with what a good guy Leonhard seems to be. I might be wrong. I often am. If he's bad, he will be fired.

If he's successful, he's a Wisconsin guy, and it's not like the home state guy would stab us in the back by trying to reset the market for DC salary and take the Bears job.

Ugh, that was too soon, even for me.

 

[CheezWizHed]

4 hours ago, patrickgpe said:

I get that. I do think many Packer fans want Leonard because they watch the badgers each week and liked his defense. If he was the d coordinator for say Alabama or USC whom most packer fans don’t watch maybe each and every week, wouldn’t be so high on him. So maybe not because he is a badger but familiar and comfortable with what he can do. 

Sure, this is true.  But it is also because we saw what he did (both NFL playing days and as DC) and that he did it well.  

I don't see anyone clamoring for Paul Chryst as one of our offensive coaches. 

[Strike4]

So I see Joe Barry is interviewing for Chicago Bears DC opening.  

Please, Please, Please offer him the job. 

 

https://www.profootballrumors.com/2024/01/bears-to-interview-joe-barry-for-dc-role-team-hires-kerry-joseph-as-qbs-coach

[Strike4]

Brandon Staley to interview for Packers DC position which the first interview I've seen scheduled. 

 

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2024/01/26/packers-to-interview-former-chargers-coach-brandon-staley-for-defensive-coordinator-job/

[HarryDoyle]

You can't make this stuff up.

 

[HarveysWBs]

36 minutes ago, Strike4 said:

Brandon Staley to interview for Packers DC position which the first interview I've seen scheduled. 

 

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2024/01/26/packers-to-interview-former-chargers-coach-brandon-staley-for-defensive-coordinator-job/

This is why I just can no longer be an optimist about the Packers. Is that arrogant to say about a team that is, by multiple measures, one of the most successful in American sports history? Yes, but it’s the truth.

This team demonstrates incredible competence in key areas that keeps it constantly competitive. Namely, they have a stable organization that is not at the whims of geriatric owners with bond-villain egos, they handle salaries well, generally find excellent value players and manage contracts well, have a preternatural knack for identifying QB talent, and subsequently attract generally bright offensive minds to the organization.

The above gets us anywhere between 70-90% of the way to the title nearly every year. But I have to stop hoping and wishing they will ever consistently figure out the rest. I’ve seen too many years end one of two ways: either our “better-than-you’d-think!” value guys can’t compete with elite talent on the other side, OR weaknesses on special teams, defense, or both torpedo games that we have absolutely no business losing.

Staley, in my opinion, would be yet another example of scenario B. His only claim to fame was a single year as DC of the Rams (2020) when he had peak cheat-code Donald and Ramsey headlining a defense that was so deep in the front that he never had to blitz and looked like a genius. That ain’t going to be the 2024 Packers, so I would expect another Fangio/Barry retread performance.

I like LaFleur. I think he’s a very good coach. But if we just do more of the same on defense (and he doesn’t figure out how to call stinking timeouts in end of half scenarios) we aren’t going to get there under this regime. I can’t keep hoping anymore. So I won’t.

[areacodes]

8 minutes ago, HarveysWBs said:

This is why I just can no longer be an optimist about the Packers. Is that arrogant to say about a team that is, by multiple measures, one of the most successful in American sports history? Yes, but it’s the truth.

This team demonstrates incredible competence in key areas that keeps it constantly competitive. Namely, they have a stable organization that is not at the whims of geriatric owners with bond-villain egos, they handle salaries well, generally find excellent value players and manage contracts well, have a preternatural knack for identifying QB talent, and subsequently attract generally bright offensive minds to the organization.

The above gets us anywhere between 70-90% of the way to the title nearly every year. But I have to stop hoping and wishing they will ever consistently figure out the rest. I’ve seen too many years end one of two ways: either our “better-than-you’d-think!” value guys can’t compete with elite talent on the other side, OR weaknesses on special teams, defense, or both torpedo games that we have absolutely no business losing.

Staley, in my opinion, would be yet another example of scenario B. His only claim to fame was a single year as DC of the Rams (2020) when he had peak cheat-code Donald and Ramsey headlining a defense that was so deep in the front that he never had to blitz and looked like a genius. That ain’t going to be the 2024 Packers, so I would expect another Fangio/Barry retread performance.

I like LaFleur. I think he’s a very good coach. But if we just do more of the same on defense (and he doesn’t figure out how to call stinking timeouts in end of half scenarios) we aren’t going to get there under this regime. I can’t keep hoping anymore. So I won’t.

This seems like a little bit of an overreaction to the first potential interview in this process.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

17 hours ago, GAME05 said:

Packers have made enough mistakes not drafting Badgers players, starting with Troy Vincent. I'd like to not do the same with former Badger coaches. If he even wants the job, anyway.

I just can't believe anyone would prefer Illinois assistant whatever he is to NFL DC. I guess someone would, but I wouldn't understand why. 

WI turned its back to him, GB would give him a fast track to NFL HC if he wants it. 

[SeaBass]

Packers interview Not Jim Leonhard, Packers fans riot. Classic.

[Joseph Zarr]

Just 3-4 years ago Staley coached the NFL's best defense by a good margin. They had Donald and Ramsey, yes, but they also had a roster outside these two stars filled with players who outperformed their careers beyond that magical season. This being said, Staley never had a defense better than 20th (Eeeeek, Barry vibes!😅) while a head coach in LA. Can he recapture that 2020 magic? I have absolutely no clue. At this point, it's just an interview and why would you not interview a guy with his CV? If it became serious, admittedly I'd be super skeptical he still has it as a coordinator. Failed HC's certainly are known to reclaim their glory as coordinators. And, I think LaFleuer and Staley could form a dynamic duo. BUT, I'd be nervous as all get out we made the wrong choice.😅

[Joseph Zarr]

13 minutes ago, SeaBass said:

Packers interview Not Jim Leonhard, Packers fans riot. Classic.

It's what we do as a Packers culture: overreact and generally expect the worst.

[Team Canada]

21 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

I just can't believe anyone would prefer Illinois assistant whatever he is to NFL DC. I guess someone would, but I wouldn't understand why. 

WI turned its back to him, GB would give him a fast track to NFL HC if he wants it. 

1. What does his current position really matter related to this conversation?

2. UW didn't think he was a bad DC, they chose not to hire him as the head coach. That again doesn't really have bearing on his viability as an NFL DC.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

22 minutes ago, Team Canada said:

1. What does his current position really matter related to this conversation?

Is that a real question? I think his current position, and anyone's current position, is valid to a potential job offer. I think it's quite a bit easier to move him from  assistant Illinois to GB DC vs, he's a HC at Iowa (or a DC at UW) and we want him to DC. Weird question. 

On point 2, I think that's pretty disingenuous. Maybe Leonhard was naiive, he probably was, but I think it was pretty obvious that one reason he turned down GB the first time was that he thought he was being groomed to run the show at UW. Safe to say that when they didn't bring him on after interim duties that he was heartbroken. And I couldn't care less about UW or JL, it's just reality.

[Joseph Zarr]

Three more names thrown into the fire:

Bills LB coach Bobby Babich

Dallas D-Line coach Aden Durde

I have to imagine we'll be seeing quite a few more names in the coming days as well. LaFleur obviously knows this is a crucial hire. I remind myself: I didn't know anything about LaFleur before he was hired either.

The third name? Rising Broncos DB coach Christian Parker.

*Also shown below. This post will no longer be obsessively edited*

[homer]

54 minutes ago, OldSchoolSnapper said:

On point 2, I think that's pretty disingenuous. Maybe Leonhard was naiive, he probably was, but I think it was pretty obvious that one reason he turned down GB the first time was that he thought he was being groomed to run the show at UW. Safe to say that when they didn't bring him on after interim duties that he was heartbroken. And I couldn't care less about UW or JL, it's just reality.

We really don't know if that's true or not. Chryst was 56 when he was fired. He could have coached another 8 - 10 years.

[HarveysWBs]

2 hours ago, areacodes said:

This seems like a little bit of an overreaction to the first potential interview in this process.

Maybe so. But considering what we know about LaFleur, namely, he likes the Fangio system, he likes people he knows, and he likes people who have ties to the Rams when he was there, I’d say Staley looks like the leader in the clubhouse.

[Strike4]

I keep wondering if the real targets for DC are coaching this weekend, Particularly on that Baltimore staff. 

[SeaBass]

 

One more name to add to @Joseph Zarr's post above.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

14 minutes ago, homer said:

We really don't know if that's true or not. Chryst was 56 when he was fired. He could have coached another 8 - 10 years.

Correct, we don't know that. We do know that JL pulled out of the job because he loved UW and wanted to be there. By that time, early 2021, the whispers were going around that Chryst's seat was getting warmer. He ended up fired in the fall of '22. 

It's fair to suggest JL had no idea if his chance to be a HC there would be any time soon, but safe to say he badly wanted the job and he had to know that some boosters were already growing tired of PC. 

I'll be the first to say I don't have a clue about JL or what he would want to do in the NFL. Personally I am hoping they snag someone with very recent NFL pedigree. I'm always sort of ambivalent about their unit's ranking and team success as I think so much of that is player personnel. I just hope they get this right because it could get them to a Super Bowl in the next 2 seasons.

[SeaBass]

17 minutes ago, HarveysWBs said:

Maybe so. But considering what we know about LaFleur, namely, he likes the Fangio system, he likes people he knows, and he likes people who have ties to the Rams when he was there, I’d say Staley looks like the leader in the clubhouse.

What's wrong with Fangio? Just because Joe Barry was a failure doesn't mean the system is flawed. I don't think, or I would hope not at least, that guys that run defenses just install a system and forget about it and refuse to innovate or pay attention to what offenses around the league are doing to counter defenses. Fangio reportedly is going right to Philly from his last job, tells me he's still highly respected. It's an offense first league and for the most part it's the players that matter which of course doesn't absolve DCs from the responsibility of getting the most out of those players.

I've pretty much said Leonhard isn't my choice but end of the day what do I know? Not much. I don't dislike him even if I think he's got a slightly overinflated popularity among the Packers fanbase. If Leonhard is ultimately hired I trust the process. My comments about him are more a criticism of the fanbase wearing blinders. I'm prepared to be wrong, I've been wrong about countless things in my life, I'll be wrong countless times more.

[Joseph Zarr]

Two Packer Report items have me fairly pumped:

And, more importantly over the duration of the next couple months, this collab with Andy Herman and the Pack-a-Day pod looks to be sublime:

Ross knows ball and the Packer Report draft guide has a really good grasp on Packers tendencies.