Josh Hader Traded to the Padres

[edfunderburk]

1 hour ago, MrTPlush said:

Not saying Rogers is garbage...but he isn't anywhere near the pitcher Hader is. If you take Rogers last 3 seasons...its pretty 'meh'. He hasn't been good this year and he has been getting to benefit from Petco Park...his HR/9 is only 0.2 and his career number is 4x that.

Nice arm for the pen, hopefully, but not sure I would put him anywhere near Hader's level.

I’m quite confident that Rogers - nor any other MLB pitcher - has ever had an inning remotely close to the meltdown bottom of the ninth that Hader recently had in San Fran … six runs on three HRs in 1/3 of an inning 

[patrickgpe]

26 minutes ago, monty57 said:

I think that's a good take on things.

For those wanting a Top 100 guy or two, I think we'd have gotten that if Rogers wasn't included in the deal. But, we're trying to win this year, so it was important to get Rogers in the deal. 

Stearns continues to amaze me. I didn't think that there would be a chance Hader was traded because playoff teams don't trade their closers mid-season. Stearns did it and ended up not really hurting the bullpen, in that at least on paper Rogers and Lamet should provide as much as Hader this year. That's pretty amazing.

The more I read about the young guys we got, the more I like them. They seem like guys who have improved their stock a lot, and neither is that far off from a potential move to Milwaukee. You never know with prospects, but there is reason to hope on them. If they keep up their progression, I think they'll be on some Top 100 lists soon for whatever that's worth.

thats a very astute point, They could have gotten a better prospect back if they didn't insist on a closer to help now. Of course we don't know how the talks went but I think is fair to assume that Stearns wasn't going to blow up 2022 to move Hader. 

[treego14]

MLB is a joke … too many minor league teams in the MLB … grooming their young stars for the Big Money-League teams.

Small market city fans should boycott!

[adambr2]

Amazing how perspectives change when we deal a guy. Hader went from the best reliever in the game to a playoff choker who maybe should be replaced by a committee in the postseason anyway just in the last few hours. 

 

Same with Rogers, who is now a top 5 closer in MLB? Cmon, I get the optimistic viewpoint but top 5 closers in MLB do not have to settle for 1 year/$7M prove it deals. 

[Jopal78]

7 minutes ago, treego14 said:

Brewers and A’s once again showing the MLB is rigged for the big market teams … we cannot keep our superstars very long.

No team can. Bryce Harper left Washington as a free agent, Albert Pujols left St. Louis as a free agent. Mookie Betts was going to leave Boston as a free agent resulting in a trade to LA. Corey Seager and Max Scherzer departed LA as free agents. Ohtani most likely is going to leave the Angels as a free agent. 

 

[MrTPlush]

5 minutes ago, edfunderburk said:

I’m quite confident that Rogers - nor any other MLB pitcher - has ever had an inning remotely close to the meltdown bottom of the ninth that Hader recently had in San Fran … six runs on three HRs in 1/3 of an inning 

He gave up nearly 40% of his runs this year in that game, sweet, exactly how I would want it from a closer. Implode epically, but rarely. 

[treego14]

2 minutes ago, Jopal78 said:

No team can. Bryce Harper left Washington as a free agent, Albert Pujols left St. Louis as a free agent. Mookie Betts was going to leave Boston as a free agent resulting in a trade to LA. Corey Seager and Max Scherzer departed LA as free agents. Ohtani most likely is going to leave the Angels as a free agent. 

 

This happens far more often with teams like Milwaukee, Oakland, etc.

[Fear The Chorizo]

6 minutes ago, treego14 said:

Brewers and A’s once again showing the MLB is rigged for the big market teams … we cannot keep our superstars very long.

aside from the fact the Brewers had Hader through his prime over 5 MLB seasons, you're right.  The Brewers were fortunate to have a dominant and reliably healthy late inning reliever at his best while he was cheap - moving on from him now instead of paying him $20M a season into the timeframe when he's likely going to get injured and definitely will see his effectiveness decrease is a smart baseball move, for both small and large market teams.

[MrTPlush]

3 minutes ago, treego14 said:

This happens far more often with teams like Milwaukee, Oakland, etc.

I mean, I don't think the Cardinals are that sad they lost Pujols because he was too expensive...and it seems like those situations are more common than being sad you lost someone to a massive contract that covers the majority of the 30s.

We got 'so lucky' to keep our guys twice in recent memory and both of them looked more like borderline disasters we wish never happened (Braun/Yelich).

[treego14]

If Hader was on the Yankees, would they have made this deal?

No way!

Payroll inequities in MLB are infuriating!

[sveumrules]

3 minutes ago, adambr2 said:

Amazing how perspectives change when we deal a guy. Hader went from the best reliever in the game to a playoff choker who maybe should be replaced by a committee in the postseason anyway just in the last few hours. 

 

Same with Rogers, who is now a top 5 closer in MLB? Cmon, I get the optimistic viewpoint but top 5 closers in MLB do not have to settle for 1 year/$7M prove it deals. 

2022 was Rogers final season of arbitration. He didn't settle for a prove it deal.

Since the start of 2018 Rogers is 5th in FIP based WAR and 16th in runs allowed based WAR among relievers.

Of course, Hader is 3rd in fWAR and 1st in rWAR, so he is better, but it's not a huge margin.  

[treego14]

Move the Brewers to the Korean League … payroll inequities are not so gross there, I bet!

[NBBrewFan]

Oakland isn't a small market.

They have small market owners with a crappy stadium in a bad location. 

[yfinn6]

2 minutes ago, treego14 said:

If Hader was on the Yankees, would they have made this deal?

No way!

Payroll inequities in MLB are infuriating!

You made your point. 

[treego14]

Fed up with building up the farm system when they will never be allowed to compete on a level playing field in the MLB … Dodgers, Yankees, etc. payrolls are infinite … no desperate moves are necessary for them ever!

[willie key]

14 minutes ago, treego14 said:

MLB is a joke … too many minor league teams in the MLB … grooming their young stars for the Big Money-League teams.

Small market city fans should boycott!

Did I wake up in the 1990s

[Fear The Chorizo]

7 minutes ago, treego14 said:

If Hader was on the Yankees, would they have made this deal?

No way!

Payroll inequities in MLB are infuriating!

They traded Aroldis Chapman to the Cubs for Gleyber Torres....so yeah they would

[markedman5]

Sounds like Brewers really like Gasser……..Stearns said they were interested in drafting him ……..fair to say they think he is a big key to this deal.

[LouisEly]

15 minutes ago, patrickgpe said:

thats a very astute point, They could have gotten a better prospect back if they didn't insist on a closer to help now. Of course we don't know how the talks went but I think is fair to assume that Stearns wasn't going to blow up 2022 to move Hader. 

I'll take it a step further and say that no way the Brewers move Hader until the off-season unless a very good reliever with closer experience is coming back in the deal.

[Playing Catch]

Just now, treego14 said:

Fed up with building up the farm system when they will never be allowed to compete on a level playing field in the MLB … Dodgers, Yankees, etc. paroles are infinite … no desperate moves are necessary for them ever!

Maybe a separate thread?

Moving along, I'm curious what people think the Brewers would've needed to give up in prospects just for Taylor Rogers?

[patrickgpe]

for those complaining that the brewers are never going to compete with the big boys. Yes you are correct. Trades like today are a fact of life as a Brewers fan. Its never going to change. If it upsets you, then maybe being a Brewers fan is not for you. 

The goal of the brewers should be to keep players as long as possible to maximize value on the field, unload them to retool To me that is more exciting and rewarding rather than just outbidding everyone else to sign the top free agent.

Also when the go all in, and sign someone like Yelich to a large deal and it doesn't go exactly perfect, fans complain too. 

Truth is closers are fickle. They can be great and all of sudden not be. Brewers history is filled with cases. If they signed Hader to a massive extension and he drops after turning 30, the same fans will be complaining about the albatross contract he signed. The brewers have shown that can go all in on a player or 2, but they can't be wrong because they aren't the Yankee who can write off a bad 200MM contract. 

[markedman5]

 

[sveumrules]

The math seems pretty simple.

Right now, Rogers to Hader is a small downgrade on the field, but an upgrade in terms of payroll flexibility for the remainder of the deadline and heading into next year. 

In the future, 13 years of Lamet/Gasser/Ruiz is likely to largely outstrip 1 year of Hader in terms of value.

Just glad he wasn't traded to the Mets, now we know Stearns is sticking around for awhile.

[Jopal78]

10 minutes ago, treego14 said:

This happens far more often with teams like Milwaukee, Oakland, etc.

I don't think that's true either. In fact, two of the last superstars the Brewers had they signed to career long extensions in Ryan Braun and Christian Yelich. 

Pro-all players by and large are going to go to free agency and sell themselves to the higher bidder, it doesn't matter what team they play for. 

[Fear The Chorizo]

4 minutes ago, markedman5 said:

Sounds like Brewers really like Gasser……..Stearns said they were interested in drafting him ……..fair to say they think he is a big key to this deal.

He's the one furthest from contributing to MLB, and likely has the most future value of all of the players involved when you factor in escalating contract costs - there's alot of upside with a pitcher who throws strikes with improving stuff only 1 year into his pro career.