Robert Murray on Brewers and CC

[brewers888]

I wonder if this is over Attanasio being cheap and losing Counsell over a couple of million or Craig just wanting to manage a team with unlimited resources. Its a shame that we are most likely going to lose the best manager in team history but money talks and this owner doesn't have it to pay big money for a manager and certainly can't compete at any level with teams like the Mets when it comes to the payroll.

Until and unless there is a salary cap in baseball the odds of this team ever winning the World Series are extreme. Stearns was always going to look for greener pastures so him taking 15 million a year from Cohen makes sense but losing the home town Counsell is a real kick in the shins.

[Brewcrew82]

10 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

 

Until and unless there is a salary cap in baseball the odds of this team ever winning the World Series are extreme. Stearns was always going to look for greener pastures so him taking 15 million a year from Cohen makes sense but losing the home town Counsell is a real kick in the shins.

Tell that to the 84 win and lower payroll Arizona Diamondbacks.

[brewers888]

1 minute ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Tell that to the 84 win and lower payroll Arizona Diamondbacks.

They haven't won it yet and if they do it will be the second low payroll team joining KC in winning a championship this century. No its not impossible to win with a low payroll but its still very difficult and unlikely.

[BlightyBrew]

3 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Tell that to the 84 win Arizona Diamondbacks.

And they also have a lower payroll than the Brewers.

[titletownking]

1 minute ago, BlightyBrew said:

And they also have a lower payroll than the Brewers.

And tanked for many years to get some serious talent infusion in the system. Something the brewers haven’t been willing to do. 

[Brewcrew82]

2 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

They haven't won it yet and if they do it will be the second low payroll team joining KC in winning a championship this century. No its not impossible to win with a low payroll but its still very difficult and unlikely.

Made more easy by the current postseason format.

Orioles, Rays, etc the list of teams succeeding nowadays with a lower payroll goes on. You just have to be playing your best baseball in October.

[Brewcrew82]

Just now, titletownking said:

And tanked for many years to get some serious talent infusion in the system. Something the brewers haven’t been willing to do. 

They literally have a top 3 farm system right now. They don’t need to tank.
 

Rays haven’t tanked in forever, either. That’s the model the Brewers are trying to follow.

Diamondbacks really only tanked for a year or two. They were in the postseason as recently as 2017.

[brewers888]

I just hope the Mets never win a championship under Stearns or Counsell.

[brewers888]

If Counsell wasn't a Wisconsin guy I probably wouldn't care as much but its really disheartening to potentially be witnessing a home town guy walk away for more money and what he probably considers a far better chance of winning.

[dlk9s]

1 hour ago, Brewcrew82 said:

but ditching Milwaukee for New York and leaving us without a WS like he committed to do is severely disappointing

Definitely gotta hold him to that commitment. Can't leave until you bring us a World Series, sorry! You might be dead before it happens, but we'll drag your corpse into the dugout until it does!

[Underachiever]

13 minutes ago, dlk9s said:

Definitely gotta hold him to that commitment. Can't leave until you bring us a World Series, sorry! You might be dead before it happens, but we'll drag your corpse into the dugout until it does!

[RobertCrawley]

46 minutes ago, Brewcrew82 said:

Made more easy by the current postseason format.

Orioles, Rays, etc the list of teams succeeding nowadays with a lower payroll goes on. You just have to be playing your best baseball in October.

Is it possible to coach grit and clutch play when the lights are brightest and everything is on the line? 

[Brewcrew82]

We’ll see if MA steps up…

[brewers888]

1 minute ago, Brewcrew82 said:

We’ll see if MA steps up…

If Attanasio was going to pay Counsell he most likely would have alreay done it. 

[RobertCrawley]

30 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

If Counsell wasn't a Wisconsin guy I probably wouldn't care as much but its really disheartening to potentially be witnessing a home town guy walk away for more money and what he probably considers a far better chance of winning.

I would not criticize a guy who took another job in any profession that was better for him and his family. 

[jerichoholicninja]

Clearly this is all just a ploy between Craig and Mark to get back at David for leaving them high and dry last offseason. Craig will take his interview and string the Mets along, dragging out negotiating his contract while feigning interest, only for him to stay with the Brewers. At this point every other manager candidate will have signed and the Mets will only have the dregs of major league coaches to chose from for their manager.

[Jopal78]

1 hour ago, Brewcrew82 said:

They literally have a top 3 farm system right now. They don’t need to tank.
 

Rays haven’t tanked in forever, either. That’s the model the Brewers are trying to follow.

Diamondbacks really only tanked for a year or two. They were in the postseason as recently as 2017.

‘14-‘17 Rays lost 343 games, The hitters were mostly all journeyman: Logan Morrison, Brad Miller, Forsythe, Loney. Maybe not a traditional tank job because of their young starting pitching, but clearly not built to compete. 

anyways, back to Counsell, the best way for him to make as much money as possible as a manager is to have multiple competing offers on the table.  The immediate outlook, for either team on the field isn’t that terrific which suggests, as always, this is about money nothing more.
 

 

[SeaBass]

2 hours ago, wibadgers23 said:

Brewers probably granting the Mets permission now so that if he does leave, Milwaukee can move forward more quickly and figure out a replacement.

There's really no point in denying permission, his contract will expire in a matter of days anyway and he'll be free to talk to anyone. Denying CC permission at this point would only serve to annoy him and they don't want to do that if they want him to stay in Milwaukee.

[brewers888]

The most likely scenario is that this is a done deal just like Bob Melvin being given permission to interview with San Francisco. Counsell probably just wants out and we are letting him do it a few days earlier.

[stoutdude04]

3 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

The most likely scenario is that this is a done deal just like Bob Melvin being given permission to interview with San Francisco. Counsell probably just wants out and we are letting him do it a few days earlier.

Or CC is going to use an offer as leverage.  The most likely scenario is that none of us have any idea what he is thinking.  That said, I am hopeful he stays.  Would be quite annoyed if he went to the Mets. Go to the AL if you are going to bounce.

[Lathund]

I still expect CC to remain a Brewer. The Mets interview will make sure he gets the raise he wants. This is not like it is with players, where a team like the Mets well and truly can outbid the Brewers. Contracts like the Scherzer and Verlander deals just aren't in the realm of possibility for the Brewers. Even a massive payraise for CC, doubling his salary, is still "only" $3.5m, and I would expect it'd take less. Managers just don't get paid *that* much, this is one area where the Brewers *can* compete financially. It's just a matter of do they want to; and I think that given the comments made by ownership and the FO and the local connections and CCs status, they will. 

Basically, as long as he gets a significant raise, I expect he stays. He can get the New York money without the New York media and fan pressure.  

[wibadgers23]

The Mets will offer Counsell a nice chunk of money and it will be on Attanasio to match. That’s pretty much it.

[markedman5]

49 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

The most likely scenario is that this is a done deal just like Bob Melvin being given permission to interview with San Francisco. Counsell probably just wants out and we are letting him do it a few days earlier.

Melvin was under contract and the Padres were ready to move on…by all accounts he and Prellar didn’t see eye to eye…that is a totally different situation ….with CC being a free agent and still being wanted by his hometown employer.

He still could leave obviously but to read into it as a “done deal” is just your emotions leading you to your biggest fear.

 

[Sixtolezcano]

3 hours ago, Brewcrew82 said:

We’ll see if MA steps up…

I wouldn’t hold my breath, might end up like Bernie.

[Sixtolezcano]

1 hour ago, brewers888 said:

The most likely scenario is that this is a done deal just like Bob Melvin being given permission to interview with San Francisco. Counsell probably just wants out and we are letting him do it a few days earlier.

True dat.