Devin Willams Trade

[jay87shot]

The Phillies could be a good option, Hoffman and Estevez are both free agents. With them going out early I could see them prioritizing the bullpen. They have a nice collection of prospects especially 18-21 year olds with pretty intriguing ceilings.

[Outlander]

5 hours ago, bigred said:

"Average" relief pitchers don't have 14.5 K/9in, like Williams does. 

The average relief arm is Peguero in this scenario not Williams.

[jay87shot]

Has the competitive balance picks been announced? Maybe the O's, Royals, Tigers, or D-backs would trade us a similar package to Burnes with a comp. pick to make up for the eventual comp pick that will be attached to Devin. Obviously the propsects would be as good as Ortiz and Hall but with all the potential picks from Willy, Levonas, and our own comp pick that would be sweet.

[wiguy94]

8 hours ago, bigred said:

"Average" relief pitchers don't have 14.5 K/9in, like Williams does. 

Average relief pitcher was referring to Elvis Peguero not Devin.

Devin, Peguero (average relief pitcher), Black and Lara (two big arrow down prospects)

 

[Austin Tatious]

If we hold Devin, wouldn’t we get a high pick back if he leaves via free agency?  So that helps the return.  

Even though his stats are great, I’m skeptical on a great return.  If we get someone in an organizational list from about 7-10 and a couple of other guys with peripherals we like (control, spin rate, breaks and movement, etc), that might be what we get.  If we can get a pick like we did with the Burke selection, that’s possible too.  I will be pleasantly surprised if we get a haul.  I’m expecting analytic darlings who aren’t greatly ranked.  Maybe one prospect on the lower end of the top 100.   But, the alternate draft pick status means teams need to make it worth our while.  

We have a good pen without him and I expect Yoho to add to it.  

[TURBO]

12 hours ago, jay87shot said:

Has the competitive balance picks been announced? Maybe the O's, Royals, Tigers, or D-backs would trade us a similar package to Burnes with a comp. pick to make up for the eventual comp pick that will be attached to Devin. Obviously the propsects would be as good as Ortiz and Hall but with all the potential picks from Willy, Levonas, and our own comp pick that would be sweet.

I've said this several times now, the O's have Felix Bautista returning, they will not be in on Williams.

[Playing Catch]

It kind of goes without saying that if they don't get an offer better than a comp pick, you roll with him next season.

Unless the Brewers are so confident in their depth, that they just trade him this offseason to mitigate injury risk.

[SF70]

A trade discussed on another board had Williams & Black to the Phillies for 2 years of Alec Bohm.

Bohm was a 3+ WAR 3B last season with big improvements defensively. $8M arby would probably be tolerable. The 2 years buys time also for our prospects including Jesus Made.

Phillies losing Estevez & Hoffman so Williams would likely appeal to them in another go for it season.

 

Another option is Edmundo Sosa from the same team if they want to hold Bohm. Good fielder, 2+ WAR in limited action. Like Bohm, 2 more years of control.

[nate82]

Bohm for Williams would be fair I think though I believe Williams value is closer to $14mm in surplus value and Bohm is closer to $16mm I don't agree with the BTV value of $22mm for Bohm and $11mm for Williams.  I think BTV has an overly inflated value of Bohm and a slightly deflated value of Williams. 

So Bohm for Williams and a lower level prospect makes sense or just Bohm for Williams also makes some sense here. 

The Phillies are probably the best option for a Williams trade followed by the Dodgers and Rangers. 

[Madhawk23]

I see a lot of Bohm mentions here.  Just curious though....why would the Phillies want to move him, and do they have a natural replacement for him at 3B?  I know some have mentioned that maybe his playing time tailed off a bit in the later part of the year, but looking at their postseason box scores - he started three of their four playoff games at 3B.  

We already know that they free agent market at 3B is not great this winter, so it's not like there are going to be many great options for them to fill his spot on the open market either?  

While I know they're probably going to need relief help this winter, wouldn't they be better off signing a couple of the available FA arms, instead of trading away their starting 3B for a guy in Williams that only has one year before he hits free agency?  

Am I missing something here?  

[Madhawk23]

Regarding the Dodgers as a potential trade partner, would a Williams for Lux swap work for both teams?  Is Lux someone that we'd be interested in?  I think he's got two more years before he hits FA, so he'd at least help bridge the gap before someone like Pratt, Made, etc. are ready to go, but he also is mostly a 2B at this stage, right?  So, I'm guessing in this scenario we'd have to move Brice over to SS, keep Ortiz at 3B and Lux at 2B. 

 Or, are there other guys in the Dodgers system that we should target instead?  Obviously, we're going to target guys that either have MLB experience already, or guys that have proven everything they can in the minors and are ready to take that next step up to the majors at the start of next season.  That of course limits the pool of potential trade candidates in a Devin deal.  

[Redd Vencher]

2 hours ago, Madhawk23 said:

Regarding the Dodgers as a potential trade partner, would a Williams for Lux swap work for both teams?  Is Lux someone that we'd be interested in?  I think he's got two more years before he hits FA, so he'd at least help bridge the gap before someone like Pratt, Made, etc. are ready to go, but he also is mostly a 2B at this stage, right?  So, I'm guessing in this scenario we'd have to move Brice over to SS, keep Ortiz at 3B and Lux at 2B. 

 Or, are there other guys in the Dodgers system that we should target instead?  Obviously, we're going to target guys that either have MLB experience already, or guys that have proven everything they can in the minors and are ready to take that next step up to the majors at the start of next season.  That of course limits the pool of potential trade candidates in a Devin deal.  

If you're trading Williams to the Dodgers, SS/3B Alex Freeland would be the target. 

[Madhawk23]

1 hour ago, Redd Vencher said:

If you're trading Williams to the Dodgers, SS/3B Alex Freeland would be the target. 

I thought about suggesting Freeland in my post, but I wasn't sure if he was a guy that would be ready to start the year next year in the big leagues?  Maybe he will be, but I have a feeling that Matt and Co. are going to be prioritizing guys that are big league ready in any deal for Devin this winter.  

[Redd Vencher]

4 minutes ago, Madhawk23 said:

I thought about suggesting Freeland in my post, but I wasn't sure if he was a guy that would be ready to start the year next year in the big leagues?  Maybe he will be, but I have a feeling that Matt and Co. are going to be prioritizing guys that are big league ready in any deal for Devin this winter.  

I think the Brewers are going to want more than 2 years of control out of a centerpiece, so I don't think the Williams for Lux or Williams for Bohm deals work. I definitely think the Brewers loook for major league ready pieces in a Williams trade. Williams for a Ramon Urias and prospects package makes sense (Urias wouldn't be the centerpiece just the big league ready one), or Williams to Boston for something like Chase Meidroth, Richard Fitts, Mikey Romero, and Elmer Rodriguez-Cruz.

[Madhawk23]

21 minutes ago, Redd Vencher said:

I think the Brewers are going to want more than 2 years of control out of a centerpiece, so I don't think the Williams for Lux or Williams for Bohm deals work. I definitely think the Brewers loook for major league ready pieces in a Williams trade. Williams for a Ramon Urias and prospects package makes sense (Urias wouldn't be the centerpiece just the big league ready one), or Williams to Boston for something like Chase Meidroth, Richard Fitts, Mikey Romero, and Elmer Rodriguez-Cruz.

My concern with your Boston package is that it feels like more of a quantity over quality situation.  I guess that's the vibe I always get when I see a 4-for-1 trade.  Meidroth in particular has some attributes that I definitely like (and that appear to match what we've been targeting in recent years), but I do worry about his lack of power profile and the fact that he would appear to be locked into 2B.  Maybe I'm completely off with this comp, but he kind of reminds me of another Mike Boeve....and if he's the best guy you're getting back in the deal, then it seems like it's kind of pointless if you already have that player profile at AA in your system.  

Just my two cents, but I appreciate you throwing out some names that you think might be intriguing.  

[TURBO]

I really want nothing to do with a trade that makes Ramon Urias the centerpiece.  Surely we can do better for Williams than Ramon Urias.  If not, then just keep him and take the pick in the next draft.

[Redd Vencher]

14 minutes ago, TURBO said:

I really want nothing to do with a trade that makes Ramon Urias the centerpiece.  Surely we can do better for Williams than Ramon Urias.  If not, then just keep him and take the pick in the next draft.

Nobody said Urias was going to be the centerpiece.

[Redd Vencher]

2 hours ago, Madhawk23 said:

My concern with your Boston package is that it feels like more of a quantity over quality situation.  I guess that's the vibe I always get when I see a 4-for-1 trade.  Meidroth in particular has some attributes that I definitely like (and that appear to match what we've been targeting in recent years), but I do worry about his lack of power profile and the fact that he would appear to be locked into 2B.  Maybe I'm completely off with this comp, but he kind of reminds me of another Mike Boeve....and if he's the best guy you're getting back in the deal, then it seems like it's kind of pointless if you already have that player profile at AA in your system.  

Just my two cents, but I appreciate you throwing out some names that you think might be intriguing.  

The Boston proposal is definitely a more quantity oriented trade. I like Elmer Roriguez-Cruz better than some of the other rankings do (Logenhagen has him 7th in Boston's system ahead of Meidroth), and think he'd do well in the pitching lab. I also think the Brewers trade Rea because he's out of options with no clear spot in the rotation and the number of arms they have. A guy like Fitts makes it even more likely. Meidroth at the very least can be an upgrade over Monasterio if Boeve forces his way onto the roster.

[BrewerFan]

9 hours ago, TURBO said:

I really want nothing to do with a trade that makes Ramon Urias the centerpiece.  Surely we can do better for Williams than Ramon Urias.  If not, then just keep him and take the pick in the next draft.

 

11 hours ago, Redd Vencher said:

Urias wouldn't be the centerpiece just the big league ready one)

 

Has a Urias as the centerpiece trade been suggested? 

[liveforoctober]

18 hours ago, Redd Vencher said:

The Boston proposal is definitely a more quantity oriented trade. I like Elmer Roriguez-Cruz better than some of the other rankings do (Logenhagen has him 7th in Boston's system ahead of Meidroth), and think he'd do well in the pitching lab. I also think the Brewers trade Rea because he's out of options with no clear spot in the rotation and the number of arms they have. A guy like Fitts makes it even more likely. Meidroth at the very least can be an upgrade over Monasterio if Boeve forces his way onto the roster.

I could be interpreting this incorrectly.. but I would really hate to trade someone like Williams and part of the accepted reasoning for the package we are getting back is that we are upgrading Mona. Mona can be upgraded 15 different ways that don't require losing assets. If we aren't getting an impactful MLB guy for our main roster or an impactful couple of guys for our farm system .. then we keep Williams and get the comp pick. If an upgrade for Mona is a throw in to the deal ... great. But it cannot be in the double digit percentile as to the reason why we accept a trade.

[jay87shot]

On 10/16/2024 at 11:06 AM, Madhawk23 said:

I see a lot of Bohm mentions here.  Just curious though....why would the Phillies want to move him, and do they have a natural replacement for him at 3B?  I know some have mentioned that maybe his playing time tailed off a bit in the later part of the year, but looking at their postseason box scores - he started three of their four playoff games at 3B.  

We already know that they free agent market at 3B is not great this winter, so it's not like there are going to be many great options for them to fill his spot on the open market either?  

While I know they're probably going to need relief help this winter, wouldn't they be better off signing a couple of the available FA arms, instead of trading away their starting 3B for a guy in Williams that only has one year before he hits free agency?  

Am I missing something here?  

The Phillies benched Bohm in the playoffs for Sosa, not really anything suggesting he will be traded. I brought up the idea a couple days ago as a what if. My thought was that Trea Turner has been a bad defensive SS, if they don't want to move Stott to SS maybe Turner would try 3rd and they could trade us Bohm and fill the free agent relief holes. Sosa can play SS or 3B or they could go after a FA.

[Redd Vencher]

2 hours ago, liveforoctober said:

I could be interpreting this incorrectly.. but I would really hate to trade someone like Williams and part of the accepted reasoning for the package we are getting back is that we are upgrading Mona. Mona can be upgraded 15 different ways that don't require losing assets. If we aren't getting an impactful MLB guy for our main roster or an impactful couple of guys for our farm system .. then we keep Williams and get the comp pick. If an upgrade for Mona is a throw in to the deal ... great. But it cannot be in the double digit percentile as to the reason why we accept a trade.

You are interpretting this incorrectly. The package for Williams is SS/3B/2B Meidroth, RHP Fitts, SS Romero, and RHP Rodriguez-Cruz. Meidroth hit .293/.437/.400/.837 132 wRC+ 105 BB:71 K in AAA. He'd be acquired because he could be your OD 3B/2B. Madhawk was wondering whether a guy like Meidroth, who has a similar profile to or own Boeve, would make sense with Boeve already in AA. If Boeve stormed his way onto the roster, at the very least Meidroth would be an upgrade over Monasterio's spot. The very least plan isn't why we'd target him.

[liveforoctober]

1 hour ago, Redd Vencher said:

You are interpretting this incorrectly. The package for Williams is SS/3B/2B Meidroth, RHP Fitts, SS Romero, and RHP Rodriguez-Cruz. Meidroth hit .293/.437/.400/.837 132 wRC+ 105 BB:71 K in AAA. He'd be acquired because he could be your OD 3B/2B. Madhawk was wondering whether a guy like Meidroth, who has a similar profile to or own Boeve, would make sense with Boeve already in AA. If Boeve stormed his way onto the roster, at the very least Meidroth would be an upgrade over Monasterio's spot. The very least plan isn't why we'd target him.

ahh yes, i read that wrong then. thank you :)

[Matt]

I don't think Devin has near the value some of you guys apparently think he does.

[Scooterfletcher]

Jedd Gyorko seemingly retired after plying for us the covid year putting up over a .800 ops and having a good glove at 3B.   Still not that old either (not happening but might make sense as a non roster guy invited to camp.)

Brett Baty makes a lot of sense imo though.   He’s a guy that probably should be mentioned more often for 3B discussion names.  Should be trade bait by the Mets.