Lucroy to Cleveland - LUCROY HAS VETOED THE TRADE

[brewmann04]

Luc will go in to offseason no need to move him for any lesser deals

[Thurston Fluff]

I think losing out on mejia is going to sting the further we get away from this trade.

 

Wouldn't be surprised to see him listed as Clevelands top prospect after this season, and among the best in baseball. Basically if this exact package were offered for lucroy at next year's deadline, with still 1.5 years left on lucroys contract, people would be universally ecstatic about that level of return.

 

I guess at least we will have these players to watch compared to whatever the brewers finally do get for Luc, and walk away affirmed that a small market team should never offer a contract with a no trade clause in it.

If we can get a deal like Luc's simply by adding a no trade clause to it I would be for it every day, all day no matter the hassle it creates when it comes time to trade them.

[Fear The Chorizo]

I think losing out on mejia is going to sting the further we get away from this trade.

 

Wouldn't be surprised to see him listed as Clevelands top prospect after this season, and among the best in baseball. Basically if this exact package were offered for lucroy at next year's deadline, with still 1.5 years left on lucroys contract, people would be universally ecstatic about that level of return.

 

I guess at least we will have these players to watch compared to whatever the brewers finally do get for Luc, and walk away affirmed that a small market team should never offer a contract with a no trade clause in it.

If we can get a deal like Luc's simply by adding a no trade clause to it I would be for it every day, all day no matter the hassle it creates when it comes time to trade them.

 

We will have to disagree on that point...I think when a small market team needs to maximize value via trade and pull the trigger, they can't be restricted by NTC limitations in the event one of the few suitors of a player happens to be on a no trade list.

 

In this instance, the same contract that supposedly makes Luc so valuable is the only reason he is still a Brewer

[Funketown]

MLBTR's most recent post seems to indicate there are still some ongoing discussions regarding Lucroy. Granted, given the timing the odds seem not to favor anything getting completed.

[MrTPlush]

MLBTR's most recent post seems to indicate there are still some ongoing discussions regarding Lucroy. Granted, given the timing the odds seem not to favor anything getting completed.

 

Why not? I'd say there is a 90%+ chance he gets traded.

[Ennder]

Rangers are back in on Lucroy so maybe something happens today.

[And That]

MLBTR's most recent post seems to indicate there are still some ongoing discussions regarding Lucroy. Granted, given the timing the odds seem not to favor anything getting completed.

Conversations have been ongoing since the winter meetings... teams pretty much know how others value their players by now. If either side has a strong will to get it done, it'll get done.

[craigharmann]

MLBTR's most recent post seems to indicate there are still some ongoing discussions regarding Lucroy. Granted, given the timing the odds seem not to favor anything getting completed.

Conversations have been ongoing since the winter meetings... teams pretty much know how others value their players by now. If either side has a strong will to get it done, it'll get done.

 

And figuring out if said player will or will not veto said trade.

[adambr2]

MLBTR's most recent post seems to indicate there are still some ongoing discussions regarding Lucroy. Granted, given the timing the odds seem not to favor anything getting completed.

Conversations have been ongoing since the winter meetings... teams pretty much know how others value their players by now. If either side has a strong will to get it done, it'll get done.

 

And figuring out if said player will or will not veto said trade.

 

Well that won't be an issue with Texas

[monty57]

Wonder if Texas is still looking at a mega deal for Lucroy, a reliever and possibly a starter.

 

I also wonder if Cleveland would want another reliever and be willing to listen to something like Jeffress for Mejia since Stearns values him so highly.

[BadgerFan]

Can you imagine if Mejia turns out to be the second coming of Mike Piazza?

[MrTPlush]

Can you imagine if Mejia turns out to be the second coming of Mike Piazza?

 

I don't want to think about it. I just want to hear a report he was actually never in the deal so I can sleep again.

[Eye Black]

Discussion underway in the Transactions / Rumors forum's The Brand New Lucroy Trade Thread, but looks like something with the Rangers may be getting close, one report mentions deal entering the "final phase" (Edit: some others disputing how close it actually is at this point).

[Never Outhustled]

Can you imagine if Mejia turns out to be the second coming of Mike Piazza?

 

I don't want to think about it. I just want to hear a report he was actually never in the deal so I can sleep again.

 

Mejia's character concerns could cause him to drift off his present path, much like Brett Lawrie. Way too much risk there.

[Thurston Fluff]

I don't know if this was mentioned but I was reading reports that Lucroy declined the trade because they wouldn't commit to him as catcher next season and wouldn't decline the option as an alternative. Seems like Luc was more than reasonable. He has always said his value is largely tied to his ability to catch and asking him to play more at other positions could possibly weaken his value on the FA market. Personally I think the more positions he can play the better but if he disagree who am I to argue? It's his life and his single chance at a big payday. He has earned the right to make that decision.

[patrickgpe]

Rangers are back in on Lucroy so maybe something happens today.

I hope so let's get Gallo

[LouisEly]

Random observations:

 

1) splitterpfj, I guess it's just you and me here. I know the deal has fallen through, but several days and about 1200 Lucroy trade posts ago I highlighted Chang and Allen as two underrated pieces of their farm system and not to be upset if they were included in a deal. Allen is a very good CF with plus-plus speed, a .415 OBP this year, and is a switch hitter. That's no throw-in. Chang is a 20-year-old SS with a .837 OPS - the 18th highest OPS in the Carolina League and 6th most HR in that league. That's Isan Diaz (.820 OPS), same age, one level higher. Think about that. Plus bats at CF and SS aren't that easy to find, and can always be traded down the road.

 

B) I think some people don't realize how rare and valuable a young catcher who has both a plus hit tool and a plus-plus arm is.

 

3) More teams will be in on Lucroy in the offseason than now. And the Red Sox will not be outdone before the trade deadline by the Indians and Cubs of all teams. Dodgers may not make a play now with the uncertainty of Kershaw, but they have all of their core pieces back next year and money coming off the books. They also have pitching, even if Urias goes to the White Sox for Sale; plenty of it.

 

4) If anyone wants to talk about predictions...

[Noche]

I was really happy with the Cleveland package as well.

[RobertR]

I was generally good with the Cleveland deal, but if Cleveland wasn't going to satisfy Lucroy's demands to waive his no-trade clause, that's just life.

 

This is the second time this year where I do wonder about Stearns' communication skills with the players. Certainly it was no surprise that a deal was in the works. Seems like Stearns could have saved himself some work and a potential headache if he had found out what Lucroy was looking for and communicated it to Cleveland in advance.

[jerichoholicninja]

How much communication would really be allowed between Lucroy and Cleveland since they aren't his employer? Isn't that tampering?

[sfl2hnq17]

I feel like the Indians wanted Stearns and Co. to do that. That's why Stearns seems to be getting a lot of the blame from the nat'l guys, i.e. Rosenthal and Olney.

 

P.S. The only part that frustrates me about the veto is that Lucroy/agent said it was because they weren't guaranteed the starting catcher role (or another role which was discussed earlier) when it definitely seems to have been more about money. Which I have no problem with; it was in the contract. Just be upfront about it being about money.

[LouisEly]

Maybe Stearns can't legally tell a player who he is in discussions with. Maybe it's not a good idea, as the player might say things to people that get leaked, weakening Stearns' bargaining power. Maybe Stearns said, "I'm in serious discussions with a team that, if the season ended today, would make the playoffs. I can't say who, but are you OK with being traded to a serious playoff contender?" I don't know who the other seven no-trade teams are, but if referencing his no-trade clause would have given the team away in terms of who it was perhaps that would have had negative consequences for Stearns in the negotiations.

 

One additional point added to the random musings above:

 

5) The Cubs didn't get to where they are by focusing on drafting/acquiring young pitching. They loaded up on young bats. Maybe that is the new inefficiency in the market.

[sfl2hnq17]

That is all true about loading up on hitting. However, two crucial things happened to their rotation: they got Arrieta in huge buy-low trade (then fixed him by moving him back to the third base side of the rubber when the Orioles wouldn't let him) and being able to sign Lester a monstrous contract.

[Fear The Chorizo]

Hadn't had much time to read through various articles and info on today's proceedings...Jim Bowden of ESPN comes down pretty harsh on Luc, and I agree with his assessment 100%...

 

"Jonathan Lucroy deal to Indians is dead. Brewers moving on. For all the things for Lucroy and his representatives to ask for to waive no-trade nothing could be dumber than asking to eradicate option year. Of course prospect return was based on not being a rental. They could have asked for 1m trade bonus, full-no trade with Indians but NOT eradicate option year because no one would do that...no one. Now he can be traded to Mets and now nor only won't be able to block trade but will now get nothing. To be concerned he won't be every day catcher in 2017 over Gomes is stultified . Bad move by Lucroy camp

 

In defense of Jonathan Lucroy and players in general if they have a no-trade clause to a team they should never be traded to that team without PRIOR consent because it's a violation of a contractual agreement. Lucroy should not be put in this position, not fair to him. That being said, in my opinion he is making a huge mistake. Chance to catch AL best rotation and impact closer and play for WS champion Terry Francona...to say he is worried about playing time in '17 with competition with Gomes is a joke. Lucroy clearly would have been every day catcher without a promise no team can give any player. Hope he changes his mind quickly before he ends up being traded to a place he doesn't want to go to but possibly won't be able to mix it since he doesn't have no trade rights to 21 teams."

[wildcat83]

ESPN reports that talks have ceased with Indians as well as Mets.

 

As potential suitors dwindle so does the leverage for any potential return.