Peralta and Myers traded for Jett Williams and Sproat

[OldHeidelberg]

24 minutes ago, CheezWizHed said:

 

So if you were to invert the trade... Would you send Logan Henderson and Cooper Pratt to NYY for Peralta and Myers? 

 

Not for those players of course but if you were to say for a 5.5 WAR  slugging 3B on an $8 million expiring deal and a bottom of the rotation starter with 5 years of control sure.  

[mudbutt]

The more I look at it, I LOVE this trade and I am not sure if the team is worse this year after the trade. My biggest concern with the team was the offense, notably Ortiz and whoever the third starting outfielder is. Plus whether Durbin is truly starter level. So now we get a guy in AAA that's a premium prospect that can play any of those positions if one of them struggles/gets injured. That is massive insurance.

Sproat meanwhile just seems like Priester and we actually get to work with him in the offseason. Not worried about the starting pitching depth. My only concern would be a playoff rotation, but can deal with that when it arrives. Plus I think the bullpen is better than ever so wouldn't be asking a ton out of the starters.

[umphrey]

Joey O is on notice. Cooper Pratt should be able to spend the full year in AAA (needed IMO).

[Ron Robinsons Beard]

When I saw this trade floated yesterday, my immediate thought was "this makes too much sense not to happen." Williams is 100% a Brewer-type player ... versatile, good defender at multiple positions, very fast, good baserunner with a very high OBP, surprising pop, but short in stature. It will be very interesting to see if he is chosen as the "SS of the future", or if that honor goes to Cooper Pratt, who is quite the yin to Williams' yang both stature and playing-style wise. 

I expect that Williams will be in Milwaukee at some point this year. And the "little guy energy" the team will have with him, Durbin and Frelick will be fun to watch.

Sproat is the type of high ceiling arm that the Brewers always seem to get the most out of. It wouldn't surprise me to see him make up much of Peralta's expected production as early as this season.  

[brewcrewrule28]

10 hours ago, wibadgers23 said:

I'm guessing that's 18th in all of baseball for Keith Law?

Correct, 18th overall.

[kestrel79]

I feel like reading this thread we have the entire A's scouting staff from Moneyball in here complaining about how tall people are. Who cares? As long as they get on base.

How many "great size" can't miss prospects have fizzled out over the years for us? Maybe we should of traded for Kevin Barker and Brad Nelson. How tall was Prince? 5'8"? He turned out pretty good.

I'm gonna sit back and trust the 2 time Front Office of the Year to do their job on this and hopefully it works out for us for long term. 

 

[CheezWizHed]

3 minutes ago, kestrel79 said:

I feel like reading this thread we have the entire A's scouting staff from Moneyball in here complaining about how tall people are. Who cares? As long as they get on base.

How many "great size" can't miss prospects have fizzled out over the years for us? Maybe we should of traded for Kevin Barker and Brad Nelson. How tall was Prince? 5'8"? He turned out pretty good.

I'm gonna sit back and trust the 2 time Front Office of the Year to do their job on this and hopefully it works out for us for long term. 

 

<5'9" is the new market efficiency! 

[RobDeer 45]

I can't pretend to say I know enough about these prospects but it appears to be a good haul for Freddy.  I trust Matt Arnold.  I love Freddy and enjoyed having him on this team.  I don't take these things personal.  I hate to see him go but know this is the only way we can continually compete with the way Major League Baseball is set up.  

 

As others have mentioned, I don't think Freddy is an ace, but a dang good number two.  Fingers crossed the guys we got back have a positive impact on our team.

[igor67]

Thinking a bit more, both Williams and Sproat have a real chance to be end of the year contributors. The beginning of the season matters of course but with the teams make-up and history they can afford a small drop in team quality at the front of the season for chances that they have guys who develop well and performing in Sept and Oct.

[TURBO]

1 hour ago, CheezWizHed said:

So if you were to invert the trade... Would you send Logan Henderson and Cooper Pratt to NYY for Peralta and Myers? 

 

Of course not, the Brewers would never trade prospect capital like that for a one year starting pitcher.  That's not how they roll...

[sveumrules]

I'm more of a leaderboard scourer than an astro physicist, but thinking out loud a little here it seems like a lot of the game these days is centered around that rising four seam fastball up in the zone.

Now obviously up in the zone means different things depending on whether a guy is 5'10" or under like a fair number of Brewers players/prospects versus say 6'3" and over.

When we hear that some guy's pitch has X amount of rise, or Y amount of run, those numbers are averages to my understanding.

So I guess what my thought comes down to is, how much (if at all) does vertical location correlate to inducing rise on a fastball? Intuitively it would feel like a pitch has more runway to rise the higher it is thrown, with incrementally less runway to rise (& more chances to miss down over the middle) the lower it goes.

If in fact there is some degree of correlation there, getting short guys with good plate discipline (& the impending arrival of ABS Challenge System) could just be another case of the Brewers playing the margins from multiple angles (with Jett's speed and defensive versatility representing two big margin plays as well).

Was definitely weird going to Peralta's player page at FanGraphs and seeing that orange Mets banner though.

Thanks for everything Freddy, in game threads truly won't be the same without pages upon pages of griping about your inability to pitch deep in games, or needing ten pitches to put a guy away, or not being a True Ace...but your fastball (& changeup & slider & curveball too) will always blaze a path straight through the heart of my zone.

[Playing Catch]

1. I loved Freddy. A consummate pro. A Brewer-for-life. I will never forget his debut.

2. I loved Tobias Myers. I think he was good enough to be included in the thread title, and was just an awesome hedge for injuries to the staff. I will never forget his start against the Mets in 2024.

3. I think the trade was as it has been described. A fair trade where the Brewers gain in total value, but that they give up a little '26 value.

4. I think Sproat's prospect-profile is better than Priester's, but I think comparing him to Priester is fair. He's got starter written all over him, and should be looking at 150+ IPs this season. I'm not predicting it, but I think it's possible (Maybe 12% chance?) Sproat outperforms Peralta as soon as this season. Peralta had a career-year last season, and Sproat had a mid-season slump in AAA last season that blunted his prospect profile. He pitched 20 big-league innings for the Mets in September (2.80 FIP), so he's been blooded. My hope is that he was working on getting outs early with soft contact on secondary stuff (improved ground-ball rate in AAA last season), because he already had strong K/BB peripherals.

5. I think the hope is that Jett becomes a slightly better hitter than Durbin* (although Durbin is better than many believe). But I think anyone expecting him to take over at shortstop are mistaken. If he's on the roster by June, I think the Brewers look at him as a Collins' replacement, who can also cover Monasterio's innings at shortstop. And going forward, I think they view him as an outfielder that can spot innings in the infield, not the other way around. More like a Zobrist-role. But the hidden advantage there, is having an "additional" bench bat. You can cover BOTH Collins and Monasterio's roles with one player. So theoretically, the Brewers could add a thumper to the roster, or add a 3rd catcher to support having Quero on the roster.

6. In terms of how this impacts 2026, I think this improves their 2026 playoff roster. YES, you lose Freddy. But I believe that nearly the entire roster could be expected to meaningfully improve from last season, including Sproat and Jett. I think they are both on that '26 playoff roster, and making contributions. I don't think Freddy repeats last season's excellence, and replacing his starts with more innings from the Brewers pitching machine-magic, I think makes the team better. Freddy and Tobias's contributions, in my opinion, were greater as reliable regular-season guys rather than playoff-perfomers, even though they both DID perform in the playoffs.

 

*I think short players are a deliberate strategy to combat the high-strike in the ABS-challenge-system world. I think we're beyond it being a coincidence of acquiring speed/defense/contact guys.

[TURBO]

I do think that Jett's size does play a factor in a lot of things defensively. 

So, pretend he's a great SS, how many balls get passed him that a great SS that is 6" or taller get to?  How many times does he make a great outstretched play, but a normal sized SS makes with ease?  If we are giving up 6" or more with every play from a tiny SS (who is playing next to a very short 3B in Durbin I might add) it has to have an effect on the game, defensively. 

Seriously, having Durbin and Williams on the left side of the infield gives up a lot defensively when both players are severely hampered by their size.  That simply can't be argued.  I'm going to bet that we would have the shortest combination on the left side of any team in MLB, maybe even in the history of MLB.  lol

There are so many instances in a baseball game where having a good reach is a definite benefit, especially when it comes to IF play.  It's called a game of inches for a reason.

Pretend he's a great CF, as some here have eluded to, how many balls is he unable to get to because he is 5 to 9 inches shorter than most CF...

His size does play a part in his/our success.

I like the guy, I hope he is a complete and total stud, and that in a couple of years, we are still talking about how we fleeced Stearns and the Mets with the trade, but dismissing his size completely isn't looking at the entire picture.

I trust that Arnold explored all his options, and in his opinion, this one benefitted us the most.

So here's to hoping that Jett and Sproat fit right in, and we have 2 more valuable pieces to our puzzle for years to come.

[tmwiese55]

I'd say generally fine with it and with both prospects. Seems like they have a good chance.  though I'd be curious on how the Baty discussion went, you'd think he's very expendable there and we had a clear need for him. 

My nitpicks would be having to give up Tobias too, he's still controlled for several years and in the MKE system I was confident he'd be a good contributor and at the least great depth.  Wish they could've found a different less immediately valuable second piece instead.    Second, that it helps our direct competition for 2nd best team in the NL.  It essentially filled the only hole the had left on the team.

[sveumrules]

13 minutes ago, TURBO said:

So, pretend he's a great SS, how many balls get passed him that a great SS that is 6" or taller get to? 

Ortiz is 5'10" and just put up +10 FRV, 5th best at SS last year.

5'8" Taylor Walls has +52 DRS at SS, most in MLB since 2021.

5'10" IKF is 5th on that same leaderboard with +27 DRS.

5'8" Nick Allen has +25 DRS | +19 FRV for his career at SS.

5'10" Anthony Volpe has +23 DRS the last three years.

Masyn Winn on the Cardinals (+15 DRS | +22 FRV) is 5'9".

Jimmy Rollins was listed at 5'7" and had +54 DRS in a seventeen year career.

5'9" Omar Vizquel played the most innings at SS in the history of the game with +129 fielding runs on BRef for his career.

Williams probably won't be a primary SS though, he's more likely to bounce around all over the place.

[Roderick]

3 hours ago, OldHeidelberg said:

Count me as one who thinks giving up Myers is a little underrated here. He has had proven MLB success, it would not be shocking if Mets get more WAR out of him than we get out of Sproat. But they weren't giving up 12 years of control for one so I can see why we had to include him. 

 

I know nothing about the prospects coming back, but I think we might be kicking ourselves over losing Myers. 

He very well could have won a starting rotation spot out of ST.  If not, I don't think we can count on more than 1-2 starters to make every start this season, so he would have been used for quite a few innings.  Hope I am wrong.

[wallus]

37 minutes ago, sveumrules said:

Ortiz is 5'10" and just put up +10 FRV, 5th best at SS last year.

5'8" Taylor Walls has +52 DRS at SS, most in MLB since 2021.

5'10" IKF is 5th on that same leaderboard with +27 DRS.

5'8" Nick Allen has +25 DRS | +19 FRV for his career at SS.

5'10" Anthony Volpe has +23 DRS the last three years.

Masyn Winn on the Cardinals (+15 DRS | +22 FRV) is 5'9".

Jimmy Rollins was listed at 5'7" and had +54 DRS in a seventeen year career.

5'9" Omar Vizquel played the most innings at SS in the history of the game with +129 fielding runs on BRef for his career.

Williams probably won't be a primary SS though, he's more likely to bounce around all over the place.

I would think range/speed would be much more important than reach

[liveforoctober]

42 minutes ago, TURBO said:

So, pretend he's a great SS, how many balls get passed him that a great SS that is 6" or taller get to?  How many times does he make a great outstretched play, but a normal sized SS makes with ease? 

Seriously, having Durbin and Williams on the left side of the infield gives up a lot defensively when both players are severely hampered by their size.  That simply can't be argued.  

How many balls do these great giant shortstops dive and get to with their amazing reach that our physically impaired guys corral routinely because their quickness/agility got them to the spot on time?

Ozzie didn't seem to mind being under 6 feet. Vizquel didn't seem to care. Didn't bother Luis Aparicio much. Jimmy Rollins never could get over it, etc etc

[Tedaldtada]

Robert Gasser, Craig Yoho, Coleman Crow, Tyson Hardin and Carlos Rodriguez are all better positioned now to soak up innings this season. Will be exciting to see them battle it out in Spring. 

The DeBerry/Letson/Dorchies wave are right behind those guys.

This might actually be the year we don’t sign a vet arm at the outset of ST. 

I cannot help but observe the Brewers seem to have a boatload of guys who can tick up their stuff for medium-length outings (30-50 pitches). My prediction is we see some sort of mutant piggyback approach this season. Shorter starts followed by high leverage swingmen eating up 2-3 inning each until the game is over. Even Megill, Koenig and Uribe are built for multi-inning work, which I would prefer, if it meant fewer appearances overall.

[OldSchoolSnapper]

2 hours ago, kestrel79 said:

I feel like reading this thread we have the entire A's scouting staff from Moneyball in here complaining about how tall people are. Who cares? As long as they get on base.

How many "great size" can't miss prospects have fizzled out over the years for us? Maybe we should of traded for Kevin Barker and Brad Nelson. How tall was Prince? 5'8"? He turned out pretty good.

I'm gonna sit back and trust the 2 time Front Office of the Year to do their job on this and hopefully it works out for us for long term. 

 

Agree but Prince Fielder wasn't short. 5'11 or 6' depending on who you ask. Not that he was Ozzie with the glove but I don't think any MLB team would allow someone 5'8 to play first.

[Frisbee Slider]

31 minutes ago, wallus said:

I would think range/speed would be much more important than reach

You must not have seen the Anthony Joseph fight against Jake Paul 🙂

[brewers888]

I think Baty should have been the target over Jett. The biggest problem with this lineup is the extreme lack of power and I just don't see Jett hitting for much once he reaches MLB. Baty has big upside with the power we so desperately need.

I am also not a fan of including Myers who I like quite a bit more than the team appears to. We do have to trust Arnold but its hard to see us winning a World Series with a lineup that just completely lacks power other than a couple of guys. For every Altuve there are tons of short  guys who once they reach MLB just don't have the power needed to be big time players.

[SeaBass]

1 minute ago, brewers888 said:

I think Baty should have been the target over Jett. The biggest problem with this lineup is the extreme lack of power and I just don't see Jett hitting for much once he reaches MLB. Baty has big upside with the power we so desperately need.

I am also not a fan of including Myers who I like quite a bit more than the team appears to. We do have to trust Arnold but its hard to see us winning a World Series with a lineup that just completely lacks power other than a couple of guys. For every Altuve there are tons of short  guys who once they reach MLB just don't have the power needed to be big time players.

Dang bro, nearly 6 months since we've seen you.

[Brewcrew82]

3 minutes ago, brewers888 said:

I think Baty should have been the target over Jett. The biggest problem with this lineup is the extreme lack of power and I just don't see Jett hitting for much once he reaches MLB. Baty has big upside with the power we so desperately need.

I am also not a fan of including Myers who I like quite a bit more than the team appears to. We do have to trust Arnold but its hard to see us winning a World Series with a lineup that just completely lacks power other than a couple of guys. For every Altuve there are tons of short  guys who once they reach MLB just don't have the power needed to be big time players.

When does Arnold start to receive some criticism?

[liveforoctober]

7 minutes ago, SeaBass said:

Dang bro, nearly 6 months since we've seen you.

*edited* I don't need to pile on. Welcome back man.